2025 Adelaide Footy League - Division 1

[jo172]

See I have an underlying suspicion that i'm not sure anyone has ever tested is that on a macro level the salary cap has caused a global increase in player payments. This was certainly the case when I was on the Committee of a club when it was brought in.

Paying players used to be extremely subjective, whereas putting a cap on the amount spent on the team and an individual player caused an objective view as to what someone was worth and entitled to. If you were otherwise paying less than the cap this caused an inflationary effect.

I also tend to think puting an objective rather than subjective value on players has caused a corrosive effect on the nature of community football and has commoditised something that is undesirable to be so.

I also share concerns about burdens of additional regulation/paperwork.

I would be very interested in stats in respect of clubs that fell over the decade before the salary cap and since such as to whether that it's saving clubs from themselves bears out.

Further, such that it works out as an equailisation manner in the AdFL i tend to think promotion/relegation does that anyway, and in the Country Comps I suspect APPS causes a greater equalisation problem in that it inevitably favours the bigger centres/towns.

I'd be concerned if we got to a shibboleth that immediately accepted it as a good thing worth preserving. I tend to think that after it's been in place for a decade (which is presumably coming up soon) Community Football undertaking a review of all of it would be good as to its merits and whether it should be persisted with, maintained or amended.

So in english......do you agree with the salary cap?

It's complicated and there should be a serious and open minded review with all options on the table (dumping it, keeping it, changing it).

My gut feel is that it's a net bad thing, but I think that someone needs to do the job properly to obtain and analyse the data to see whether it's achieving its purpose, and if it is achieving its purpose, whether improvements can be made, and if it's not achieving its purpose, do we get rid of it completely.

It's really not a shoot from the hip thing.

[tigerpie]

Interesting read this subject.
All club philosophy that I know of is put time, money and effort in your junior programs.
If you do this well enough then the club should thrive.
If all of a sudden more money becomes available, instead of putting into your juniors, it goes to a senior recruits pocket.
And that 17 year old lad that's come through your juniors can't get into the ones so he leaves or quits footy all together.

You can't buy a good healthy club culture and therefore buying premierships is a very risky business long term.

[wenchbarwer]

Interesting read this subject.
All club philosophy that I know of is put time, money and effort in your junior programs.
If you do this well enough then the club should thrive.
If all of a sudden more money becomes available, instead of putting into your juniors, it goes to a senior recruits pocket.
And that 17 year old lad that's come through your juniors can't get into the ones so he leaves or quits footy all together.
You can't buy a good healthy club culture and therefore buying premierships is a very risky business long term.

$hoe$

[AdelaideSaint73]

Salary Cap is about SANFL not losing players to local footy.

All that is needed is the player points, if clubs want to spend dollars so be it, they will either succeed or they won't and will suffer the consequences. Player points was designed to even the competitions, it should also stop clubs loading up with players and force development.

The only unfair aspect of the points system is the old scholars having the advantage because some kid went to the college, which totally ignores that in the formative years community clubs developed them.

Having been involved with both College sides and Community clubs sides I've grown sick of this argument. College sides have the exact same access to those players who were at their school as the Community club does. If they played juniors at the club they are zero points, if they played College football they are zero points. The community club would then need to have a look at why the particular player would choose the College side over them surely. Many College footballers return to their community club when they finish school.

For River Murray - this means I am in favour of the current APPS.

[River Murray]

Salary Cap is about SANFL not losing players to local footy.

All that is needed is the player points, if clubs want to spend dollars so be it, they will either succeed or they won't and will suffer the consequences. Player points was designed to even the competitions, it should also stop clubs loading up with players and force development.

The only unfair aspect of the points system is the old scholars having the advantage because some kid went to the college, which totally ignores that in the formative years community clubs developed them.

Having been involved with both College sides and Community clubs sides I've grown sick of this argument. College sides have the exact same access to those players who were at their school as the Community club does. If they played juniors at the club they are zero points, if they played College football they are zero points. The community club would then need to have a look at why the particular player would choose the College side over them surely. Many College footballers return to their community club when they finish school.

For River Murray - this means I am in favour of the current APPS.

Agree with you......college clubs are no different.....more lurks an perks and jobs.....community clubs more brown paper bags
Agree with points.......salary crap is a waste of time and useless

Can't be controlled......2/3rds of clubs in the state go over salary cap.....can't be policed.....caught 4 clubs in 10 years
Spent over $1 million in trying to implement a salary crap.....which they cant do.....put the money into juniors rather than wasting time
Volunteers spend a gazillion hours doing paper work......points only and no salary crap
Clubs will always find ways around it......especially us in country areas

[Jimmy_041]

Salary Cap is about SANFL not losing players to local footy.

All that is needed is the player points, if clubs want to spend dollars so be it, they will either succeed or they won't and will suffer the consequences. Player points was designed to even the competitions, it should also stop clubs loading up with players and force development.

The only unfair aspect of the points system is the old scholars having the advantage because some kid went to the college, which totally ignores that in the formative years community clubs developed them.

Having been involved with both College sides and Community clubs sides I've grown sick of this argument. College sides have the exact same access to those players who were at their school as the Community club does. If they played juniors at the club they are zero points, if they played College football they are zero points. The community club would then need to have a look at why the particular player would choose the College side over them surely. Many College footballers return to their community club when they finish school.

For River Murray - this means I am in favour of the current APPS.

Totally correct. The junior can qualify for either the old collegians or district via years / games played
If they have never played senior football, they can also go and play anywhere for zero points.
But, getting those facts into some idiots brains is impossible.

[AdelaideSaint73]

Salary Cap is about SANFL not losing players to local footy.

All that is needed is the player points, if clubs want to spend dollars so be it, they will either succeed or they won't and will suffer the consequences. Player points was designed to even the competitions, it should also stop clubs loading up with players and force development.

The only unfair aspect of the points system is the old scholars having the advantage because some kid went to the college, which totally ignores that in the formative years community clubs developed them.

Having been involved with both College sides and Community clubs sides I've grown sick of this argument. College sides have the exact same access to those players who were at their school as the Community club does. If they played juniors at the club they are zero points, if they played College football they are zero points. The community club would then need to have a look at why the particular player would choose the College side over them surely. Many College footballers return to their community club when they finish school.

For River Murray - this means I am in favour of the current APPS.

Totally correct. The junior can qualify for either the old collegians or district via years / games played
If they have never played senior football, they can also go and play anywhere for zero points.
But, getting those facts into some idiots brains is impossible.

Bit like the -1 excuse for not having 4 players on the bench. Has to happen. Still too many games decided by injuries instead of true form.

[jo172]

Salary Cap is about SANFL not losing players to local footy.

All that is needed is the player points, if clubs want to spend dollars so be it, they will either succeed or they won't and will suffer the consequences. Player points was designed to even the competitions, it should also stop clubs loading up with players and force development.

The only unfair aspect of the points system is the old scholars having the advantage because some kid went to the college, which totally ignores that in the formative years community clubs developed them.

Having been involved with both College sides and Community clubs sides I've grown sick of this argument. College sides have the exact same access to those players who were at their school as the Community club does. If they played juniors at the club they are zero points, if they played College football they are zero points. The community club would then need to have a look at why the particular player would choose the College side over them surely. Many College footballers return to their community club when they finish school.

For River Murray - this means I am in favour of the current APPS.

Totally correct. The junior can qualify for either the old collegians or district via years / games played
If they have never played senior football, they can also go and play anywhere for zero points.
But, getting those facts into some idiots brains is impossible.

For this precise reason I'm baffled that Matt Nunn attracts points. Played 2 senior games at Payneham in 2013 yet somehow returns a decade later as a 4 pointer.

[Jimmy_041]

Salary Cap is about SANFL not losing players to local footy.

All that is needed is the player points, if clubs want to spend dollars so be it, they will either succeed or they won't and will suffer the consequences. Player points was designed to even the competitions, it should also stop clubs loading up with players and force development.

The only unfair aspect of the points system is the old scholars having the advantage because some kid went to the college, which totally ignores that in the formative years community clubs developed them.

Having been involved with both College sides and Community clubs sides I've grown sick of this argument. College sides have the exact same access to those players who were at their school as the Community club does. If they played juniors at the club they are zero points, if they played College football they are zero points. The community club would then need to have a look at why the particular player would choose the College side over them surely. Many College footballers return to their community club when they finish school.

For River Murray - this means I am in favour of the current APPS.

Totally correct. The junior can qualify for either the old collegians or district via years / games played
If they have never played senior football, they can also go and play anywhere for zero points.
But, getting those facts into some idiots brains is impossible.

For this precise reason I'm baffled that Matt Nunn attracts points. Played 2 senior games at Payneham in 2013 yet somehow returns a decade later as a 4 pointer.

I dont have a black belt in the APPS.
@Down the Hill may be able to explain

[wenchbarwer]

Thought you had to play 25 games to be a zero pointer? As Nunn came straight from Norwood to PNU, he'd be worth 4 points in 2024.

https://sanfl-content.imgix.net/content ... cument.pdf

Section 8.8.2

[Brodlach]

Thought you had to play 25 games to be a zero pointer? As Nunn came straight from Norwood to PNU, he'd be worth 4 points in 2024.

https://sanfl-content.imgix.net/content ... cument.pdf

Section 8.8.2

Correct

[The Bedge]

20 games.

[jo172]

Thought you had to play 25 games to be a zero pointer? As Nunn came straight from Norwood to PNU, he'd be worth 4 points in 2024.

https://sanfl-content.imgix.net/content ... cument.pdf

Section 8.8.2

But played in 2013, before senior footy for norwood.

[Jimmy_041]

Thought you had to play 25 games to be a zero pointer? As Nunn came straight from Norwood to PNU, he'd be worth 4 points in 2024.

https://sanfl-content.imgix.net/content ... cument.pdf

Section 8.8.2

But played in 2013, before senior footy for norwood.

My recollection is everybody is a zero pointer at any first senior club

[AdelaideSaint73]

Without having the full details, if he didn't play 20+ games at any junior club, his first club would be Norwood and therefore 4 points for anyone.

[jo172]

Thought you had to play 25 games to be a zero pointer? As Nunn came straight from Norwood to PNU, he'd be worth 4 points in 2024.

https://sanfl-content.imgix.net/content ... cument.pdf

Section 8.8.2

But played in 2013, before senior footy for norwood.

My recollection is everybody is a zero pointer at any first senior club

It seems this isn't the case.

If you play <20 games at your first club (and weren't a junior or other zero pointer) if you go else where such that you attract points, and return to that club, you will come back on points, even if that is your first club.

[scottroo]

I’m not sure what the issue is? He’s not a Payneham junior; they’ve invested nothing in him as a junior, he’s played a token two games before playing years in the SANFL system, what right do they have over any other club because he’s played two games? We have had guys return who have played 19 games of junior footy over multiple seasons for us, who are returning as 3 point players!

[jo172]

I’m not sure what the issue is? He’s not a Payneham junior; they’ve invested nothing in him as a junior, he’s played a token two games before playing years in the SANFL system, what right do they have over any other club because he’s played two games? We have had guys return who have played 19 games of junior footy over multiple seasons for us, who are returning as 3 point players!

No issue, just testing whether the proposition that you're zero points at your fist registered club as a senior is accurate which was put earlier.

[jo172]

As a hypothetical for example, a bloke who has never played before comes out and plays a season of Bs and As for you but you don't make final so he only plays 18 games

He shows some talent, then goes to a SANFL club and plays two games of reserves, does an ACL, never plays for them again. He quits that and leaves and returns to you.

Seems somewhat odd that this hypothetical player would be worth 3 points notwithstanding he's returning to the only club he'd ever played at and played far less footy for the club he's notionally a three pointer for than the club he is returning to.

[scottroo]

As a majority of his games in the last 24 months we’re with his home club he’d be returning as a zero, if he didn’t play for a season after doing his acl and only playing 2 games, he’d also be a zero as he’d played less than 5 games in 2 years