Grade Cricket

[Tony Clifton]

Kensington's batting has gone to pieces recently

[Eagles2014]

More contrived results yesterday. Woodville & Port both declaring 5 wickets down in their 1st Innings.

Have said on here for many years how I hate the 0/0 decs. With relegation etc in play now they have affected the premiership table immensely. They are going to change it next year apparently but no help to someone like WT who have been affected the most (no bias there obviously ).

Will just have to win next two games now. After the tension and pitch dramas last clash, no doubt Woodville will prepare a pitch flatter than Anzac Hwy and will be no generous declarations this match (weather could be major factor too!)

[Minimum Chips]

Looking at the Div 1 ladder, it would suggest Adelaide and Sturt would be safe for Div 1 next year (likely Kensington and possibly/probably Port as well) and Woodville straight back to Div 2. A fight between the other 3 to finish above 7th.
I have heard that it will change next year - 8th straight down and 1st place from Div 2 straight up. Play-off between Div 1 7th place and Div 2 runner up (technically 7th v 10th) for the final placing in Div 1.
However, it can change if a merger were to eventuate. I have heard discussions between 2 clubs are more advanced than they ever have been but whether it ends up happening in time for next season I don't know.

[Aerie]

Looking at the Div 1 ladder, it would suggest Adelaide and Sturt would be safe for Div 1 next year (likely Kensington and possibly/probably Port as well) and Woodville straight back to Div 2. A fight between the other 3 to finish above 7th.
I have heard that it will change next year - 8th straight down and 1st place from Div 2 straight up. Play-off between Div 1 7th place and Div 2 runner up (technically 7th v 10th) for the final placing in Div 1.
However, it can change if a merger were to eventuate. I have heard discussions between 2 clubs are more advanced than they ever have been but whether it ends up happening in time for next season I don't know.

Which 2 clubs?

[Minimum Chips]

Looking at the Div 1 ladder, it would suggest Adelaide and Sturt would be safe for Div 1 next year (likely Kensington and possibly/probably Port as well) and Woodville straight back to Div 2. A fight between the other 3 to finish above 7th.
I have heard that it will change next year - 8th straight down and 1st place from Div 2 straight up. Play-off between Div 1 7th place and Div 2 runner up (technically 7th v 10th) for the final placing in Div 1.
However, it can change if a merger were to eventuate. I have heard discussions between 2 clubs are more advanced than they ever have been but whether it ends up happening in time for next season I don't know.

Which 2 clubs?

Yours and your opponent this week.
Having said that, when I mentioned "advanced" this is coming off a pretty low base. My source, who I have zero doubt they are wrong, mentioned this earlier in the year when they had been in conversation with a couple of inner sanctum people from one of the clubs, who had said there had been discussions about exploring a merger.
Happy to be refuted or otherwise. How much involved are you at WT? Can you shed any light or debunk the above? I'm not trying to be mischievous here - just saying what I was told by someone who I have full confidence in they know what they are talking about.
A merger (between whoever) would also shake things up. Would it still be 2 divisions (6 and 6 and get rid of the 19s) or back to one comp?

[wycbloods]

Looking at the Div 1 ladder, it would suggest Adelaide and Sturt would be safe for Div 1 next year (likely Kensington and possibly/probably Port as well) and Woodville straight back to Div 2. A fight between the other 3 to finish above 7th.
I have heard that it will change next year - 8th straight down and 1st place from Div 2 straight up. Play-off between Div 1 7th place and Div 2 runner up (technically 7th v 10th) for the final placing in Div 1.
However, it can change if a merger were to eventuate. I have heard discussions between 2 clubs are more advanced than they ever have been but whether it ends up happening in time for next season I don't know.

Which 2 clubs?

Yours and your opponent this week.
Having said that, when I mentioned "advanced" this is coming off a pretty low base. My source, who I have zero doubt they are wrong, mentioned this earlier in the year when they had been in conversation with a couple of inner sanctum people from one of the clubs, who had said there had been discussions about exploring a merger.
Happy to be refuted or otherwise. How much involved are you at WT? Can you shed any light or debunk the above? I'm not trying to be mischievous here - just saying what I was told by someone who I have full confidence in they know what they are talking about.
A merger (between whoever) would also shake things up. Would it still be 2 divisions (6 and 6 and get rid of the 19s) or back to one comp?

i can say that is absolutely not true

[Eagles2014]

Looking at the Div 1 ladder, it would suggest Adelaide and Sturt would be safe for Div 1 next year (likely Kensington and possibly/probably Port as well) and Woodville straight back to Div 2. A fight between the other 3 to finish above 7th.
I have heard that it will change next year - 8th straight down and 1st place from Div 2 straight up. Play-off between Div 1 7th place and Div 2 runner up (technically 7th v 10th) for the final placing in Div 1.
However, it can change if a merger were to eventuate. I have heard discussions between 2 clubs are more advanced than they ever have been but whether it ends up happening in time for next season I don't know.

Which 2 clubs?

Yours and your opponent this week.
Having said that, when I mentioned "advanced" this is coming off a pretty low base. My source, who I have zero doubt they are wrong, mentioned this earlier in the year when they had been in conversation with a couple of inner sanctum people from one of the clubs, who had said there had been discussions about exploring a merger.
Happy to be refuted or otherwise. How much involved are you at WT? Can you shed any light or debunk the above? I'm not trying to be mischievous here - just saying what I was told by someone who I have full confidence in they know what they are talking about.
A merger (between whoever) would also shake things up. Would it still be 2 divisions (6 and 6 and get rid of the 19s) or back to one comp?

I am no longer involved there but still speak to people close, as WYCBloods said I would highly doubt this. Even the hatred between the clubs over the pitch debacle few weeks ago would make it impossible to have discussions like this

Just get rid of Prospect, about 9 wooden spoons in last 11 years, they are a disgrace. I feel they still want to get to 10 teams to have one division again, think with 12 would still be two divisions.

[Bluedemon]

Looking at the Div 1 ladder, it would suggest Adelaide and Sturt would be safe for Div 1 next year (likely Kensington and possibly/probably Port as well) and Woodville straight back to Div 2. A fight between the other 3 to finish above 7th.
I have heard that it will change next year - 8th straight down and 1st place from Div 2 straight up. Play-off between Div 1 7th place and Div 2 runner up (technically 7th v 10th) for the final placing in Div 1.
However, it can change if a merger were to eventuate. I have heard discussions between 2 clubs are more advanced than they ever have been but whether it ends up happening in time for next season I don't know.

Which 2 clubs?

Yours and your opponent this week.
Having said that, when I mentioned "advanced" this is coming off a pretty low base. My source, who I have zero doubt they are wrong, mentioned this earlier in the year when they had been in conversation with a couple of inner sanctum people from one of the clubs, who had said there had been discussions about exploring a merger.
Happy to be refuted or otherwise. How much involved are you at WT? Can you shed any light or debunk the above? I'm not trying to be mischievous here - just saying what I was told by someone who I have full confidence in they know what they are talking about.
A merger (between whoever) would also shake things up. Would it still be 2 divisions (6 and 6 and get rid of the 19s) or back to one comp?

I am no longer involved there but still speak to people close, as WYCBloods said I would highly doubt this. Even the hatred between the clubs over the pitch debacle few weeks ago would make it impossible to have discussions like this

Just get rid of Prospect, about 9 wooden spoons in last 11 years, they are a disgrace. I feel they still want to get to 10 teams to have one division again, think with 12 would still be two divisions.

Wouldn't 12 teams still be okay where they can play 11 rounds

[Eagles2014]

You would think so Bluedemon, makes perfect sense!!

All about better comp to help the Redbacks and they are fixated on that being no longer Kensy vs Southerns for instance

[Aerie]

Looking at the Div 1 ladder, it would suggest Adelaide and Sturt would be safe for Div 1 next year (likely Kensington and possibly/probably Port as well) and Woodville straight back to Div 2. A fight between the other 3 to finish above 7th.
I have heard that it will change next year - 8th straight down and 1st place from Div 2 straight up. Play-off between Div 1 7th place and Div 2 runner up (technically 7th v 10th) for the final placing in Div 1.
However, it can change if a merger were to eventuate. I have heard discussions between 2 clubs are more advanced than they ever have been but whether it ends up happening in time for next season I don't know.

Which 2 clubs?

Yours and your opponent this week.
Having said that, when I mentioned "advanced" this is coming off a pretty low base. My source, who I have zero doubt they are wrong, mentioned this earlier in the year when they had been in conversation with a couple of inner sanctum people from one of the clubs, who had said there had been discussions about exploring a merger.
Happy to be refuted or otherwise. How much involved are you at WT? Can you shed any light or debunk the above? I'm not trying to be mischievous here - just saying what I was told by someone who I have full confidence in they know what they are talking about.
A merger (between whoever) would also shake things up. Would it still be 2 divisions (6 and 6 and get rid of the 19s) or back to one comp?

I'm not closely involved now (just a member/sponsor), but haven't heard anything from those closely involved that would suggest anything. There's been ongoing dialogue between some senior club people from both clubs since the turn of the century.

I personally don't see how any form of merger will help unless it was full commitment to come to Henley, but even then you risk collateral damage to playing groups etc. Even if WT land in Div 2 next season, we've seen strong clubs such as Sturt and Glenelg bounce straight back. I would expect the same, if not, you work your way back. On the back of one of WT most successful decades ever for the senior men, having just won the One Day Cup and runner up in the T20, juniors having their strongest season for many years, women's program strong with three teams and a Labor commitment to spend $3 million redeveloping the clubrooms at Henley, I'm not sure now is the time for a club that's been around for 170 years to be looking at merging. But, that is just looking from the outside.

[Bluedemon]

If anyone has an Advertiser subscription, there is an article that Andrew Capel wrote, be good if someone could share it on here to read

[Insider_Trading]

If anyone has an Advertiser subscription, there is an article that Andrew Capel wrote, be good if someone could share it on here to read

Can copy and paste. One moment


Wonder if there will be any play tomorrow?
Turning these 2 day games into 1 day games next week?
West Torrens will want to play v Woodville

Heard that Woodville appealed the ruling on the wet pitch at Henley from a few weeks ago too.

[Minimum Chips]

If anyone has an Advertiser subscription, there is an article that Andrew Capel wrote, be good if someone could share it on here to read

Can copy and paste. One moment


Wonder if there will be any play tomorrow?
Turning these 2 day games into 1 day games next week?
West Torrens will want to play v Woodville

Heard that Woodville appealed the ruling on the wet pitch at Henley from a few weeks ago too.

Here it is (I've cut out the rubbish ads and pictures):

SA cricket’s integrity questioned as ‘flawed’ points system faces review
A sly tactic gripping the state’s premier cricket competition is gaining attention for the wrong reasons, with fears a flawed rule is leading to unsporting outcomes.

South Australian cricket’s top club competition could be forced to change its points system next season following the integrity of its Division 1 First Grade competition being called into question.
A series of early first innings declarations – and then double declarations – in SACA Premier Cricket’s elite First Grade Division 1 has left some clubs frustrated and searching for answers as rivals give up their first innings run chases, conceding the result, in search of precious second innings points.
Under current Premier Cricket bylaws, clubs are awarded 20 points for a first innings win, 10 points for a second innings victory (outright) and only five points for a draw.
With clubs fearing the dreaded drop to Division 2 under SACA’s controversial two division model, which was introduced three years ago (there are eight teams in Division 1 and six in Division 2), there have been several questionable declarations, particularly since Christmas, which have changed the course of matches and led to cries of “it’s just not cricket’’.
In Round 5, Port Adelaide declared its first innings closed at 5-86 in pursuit of Kensington’s 8-291, despite having former Western Australia and South Australia first-class batsman Jake Carder still at the crease.
The Browns then declared at 0-0 without facing a ball in their second dig and the Magpies chased down their outright target of 206 for the loss of seven wickets.
Kensington was awarded 20 points and Port 10, while clubs who fought out heard-earned draws gained only five points.
In the same round, Adelaide closed its first innings at 6-30 after facing only 19 overs chasing Sturt’s 6-299 and then, after the Blues declared at 0-0, won outright.
Port and Woodville also set up outright results in Round 8 last weekend – against Tea Tree Gully and Adelaide respectively – by giving up first innings run chases and declaring for the loss of only five wickets.
The contentious declarations are almost certain to see Premier Cricket clubs push to adopt a new points system next season.
Queensland Premier Cricket has guarded against the manipulation of second innings points by reducing first innings points if a team loses outright.
For example, their eight points for a first innings victory are cut to four upon an outright defeat.
Port coach Matthew Weeks said the current SACA points system was “flawed’’ and needed to be reviewed.
“I’ve been around cricket a long time and I know how I’d like the game to be played but the reality is, under the current rules, if you chase a total down in the second innings you get 10 points whereas if you bat your tails off after being five-for early you might get only five points, which doesn’t make any sense,’’ he said.
“It’s a flawed system and we, as a club, are just playing within the rules and trying to get as many points as we can.

“Every time we’ve declared we haven’t thought about the ramifications for other clubs, it’s only been about getting as many points as we can in order to stay in Division 1, make finals and put ourselves in the best position to win a flag.’’

SACA Premier Cricket manager Jason Herriot said the association would “invite clubs to propose changes’’ to its bylaws at the end of the season.
“The bylaws and playing conditions are approved by the Premier Cricket Committee ahead of each season,’’ he said.
“SACA invites clubs to propose changes to the bylaws and playing conditions at the conclusion of each season if they see a need. Any such proposals are then put to a vote by the PCC to determine.’’
There is plenty at stake with two rounds to play in SACA First Grade.
Only 15 points separates first-placed Adelaide (110 points) from fourth-placed Port (95) in the top four, with Sturt (105) and Kensington (100) sitting second and third.
Tea Tree Gully and East Torrens (75 points), along with seventh-placed West Torrens (60), can still play finals, with bottom-placed Woodville (20) almost certain to be relegated to Division 2 next season.
The bottom two will be relegated and replaced by the top two Division 2 teams.
Glenelg has already earned promotion, having dominated the second tier competition this season.

[Insider_Trading]

If anyone has an Advertiser subscription, there is an article that Andrew Capel wrote, be good if someone could share it on here to read

.South Australian cricket’s top club competition could be forced to change its points system next season following the integrity of its Division 1 First Grade competition being called into question.

A series of early first innings declarations – and then double declarations – in SACA Premier Cricket’s elite First Grade Division 1 has left some clubs frustrated and searching for answers as rivals give up their first innings run chases, conceding the result, in search of precious second innings points.

Under current Premier Cricket bylaws, clubs are awarded 20 points for a first innings win, 10 points for a second innings victory (outright) and only five points for a draw.

With clubs fearing the dreaded drop to Division 2 under SACA’s controversial two division model, which was introduced three years ago (there are eight teams in Division 1 and six in Division 2), there have been several questionable declarations, particularly since Christmas, which have changed the course of matches and led to cries of “it’s just not cricket’’.

In Round 5, Port Adelaide declared its first innings closed at 5-86 in pursuit of Kensington’s 8-291, despite having former Western Australia and South Australia first-class batsman Jake Carder still at the crease.

The Browns then declared at 0-0 without facing a ball in their second dig and the Magpies chased down their outright target of 206 for the loss of seven wickets.

Kensington was awarded 20 points and Port 10, while clubs who fought out heard-earned draws gained only five points.

In the same round, Adelaide closed its first innings at 6-30 after facing only 19 overs chasing Sturt’s 6-299 and then, after the Blues declared at 0-0, won outright.


Port and Woodville also set up outright results in Round 8 last weekend – against Tea Tree Gully and Adelaide respectively – by giving up first innings run chases and declaring for the loss of only five wickets.

The contentious declarations are almost certain to see Premier Cricket clubs push to adopt a new points system next season.

Queensland Premier Cricket has guarded against the manipulation of second innings points by reducing first innings points if a team loses outright.

For example, their eight points for a first innings victory are cut to four upon an outright defeat.

Port coach Matthew Weeks said the current SACA points system was “flawed’’ and needed to be reviewed.

“I’ve been around cricket a long time and I know how I’d like the game to be played but the reality is, under the current rules, if you chase a total down in the second innings you get 10 points whereas if you bat your tails off after being five-for early you might get only five points, which doesn’t make any sense,’’ he said.

“It’s a flawed system and we, as a club, are just playing within the rules and trying to get as many points as we can.

Every time we’ve declared we haven’t thought about the ramifications for other clubs, it’s only been about getting as many points as we can in order to stay in Division 1, make finals and put ourselves in the best position to win a flag.’’

SACA Premier Cricket manager Jason Herriot said the association would “invite clubs to propose changes’’ to its bylaws at the end of the season.

“The bylaws and playing conditions are approved by the Premier Cricket Committee ahead of each season,’’ he said.

“SACA invites clubs to propose changes to the bylaws and playing conditions at the conclusion of each season if they see a need. Any such proposals are then put to a vote by the PCC to determine.’’

There is plenty at stake with two rounds to play in SACA First Grade.

Only 15 points separates first-placed Adelaide (110 points) from fourth-placed Port (95) in the top four, with Sturt (105) and Kensington (100) sitting second and third.

Tea Tree Gully and East Torrens (75 points), along with seventh-placed West Torrens (60), can still play finals, with bottom-placed Woodville (20) almost certain to be relegated to Division 2 next season.

The bottom two will be relegated and replaced by the top two Division 2 teams.

Glenelg has already earned promotion, having dominated the second tier competition this season.



/quote]

[Aerie]

If anyone has an Advertiser subscription, there is an article that Andrew Capel wrote, be good if someone could share it on here to read

Can copy and paste. One moment


Wonder if there will be any play tomorrow?
Turning these 2 day games into 1 day games next week?
West Torrens will want to play v Woodville

Heard that Woodville appealed the ruling on the wet pitch at Henley from a few weeks ago too.

Better for all games to be called off and a one-dayer next week. Almost guaranteed to lose a lot of play tomorrow, which means a draw is most likely outcome in week 2.

[Aerie]

A simple fix for points system is:

Win 1st Innings 20pts
Draw 10pts
Win 1st Innings & Outright 30pts
Win 1st Innings & Lose Outright 15pts
Lose 1st Innings & Win Outright 15pts

Weeks is spot on with his comments. It’s the points system that is providing incentive and it should’ve been addressed years ago.

PS. If I was running Premier Cricket I’d have 1st Grade playing 3-day games Sat/Sat/Sun under Shield points system and play each team once, and fit in T20 comp & One Day comp on spare Saturday’s & mid-week for T20’s.

[Tony Clifton]

Perhaps keep legitimate outright points as they are now
20 points for winning on 1st innings
Extra 10 points for winning outright

However if there is any "declaration behind" during the game, the extra points available drops down to 5 points, the same as for a draw

[Insider_Trading]

East Torrens - TTG game got underway a short time ago.

Funny declarations coming up next week in the other Division 1 games with 105 overs to be bowled.

[Port Pirie Power]

Next week may be a rarity with no declarations. The top 4 all play each other and won’t want to give up points to each other, Woodville won’t want to do WT any favours you would imagine.

Perhaps maybe only TTG and ET may set up a game, if they haven’t agreed to already.

[Tony Clifton]

Win the toss and bowl the only chance for points next week