SAAFL Division 7 & D7R (2012)

[morell]

There is some strong broscience going on here.

Morell to suggest when you hit a certain age your physical capabilities some how hits some sort of constant is ridiculous.

not really what i was trying to say, my point was that for some players once you get to a certain age training twice instead of once is not going to dramatically improve your output on gameday, provided you have an existing core strength and fitness base. If anything it might even make you more susceptible to injury. Others may thrive on it, whatevs, different strokes for different folks, i just dont think someone saying that they only want to train once a week should be dismissed as a concept nor should it be considered herecy just because it may go against traditional football "wisdom". Doesnt mean they shouldnt train or shouldnt do a pre season or shouldnt try, nor does fitness and strength not matter

I know for a fact that due to my history of chronic injuries and physiology i play better on Saturdays if I dont train on Tuesdays. Thats just me, i know of others like me, i also know of players that have to train in order to get up for saturdays.

There is not one blanket rule or methodology that works for everyone, despite how many years said methodology has been bandied about as gospel

[LaughingKookaburra]

Cast aside all the sports science theories, we all know amateur football is mind over matter and even AFL.

*If you beleive you are fitter than your opponent does this improve your mindset during the game?? Yes

*If you train with 40 plus blokes twice a week does this help more so than training with 12 players twice or once a week?? I have had expereince with both and the answer is yes. Does this improve your mind set going into games?? Yes

*Do your team mates respect you more on and off field field if you train twice a week?? Absolutely

The more boxes you tick mentally the bigger edge you give yourself to win. The more you train together the more you get to know each other. The more you know each other the more you know what your team mates are capable of. If you tick every box then the more you beleive you can win @ any stage of the game (Feeling bullet proof).

I'm lucky enough to have played in a premiership and the arrogance of knowing you can win @ any stage of the game is the number 1 key to success....Done with bloody hard work.

If you can pay for a phsyc to mentally give you these advantages well go ahead. Or you can just train twice a week and do your health some good aswell.

[Yank Man]

Cast aside all the sports science theories, we all know amateur football is mind over matter and even AFL.

*If you beleive you are fitter than your opponent does this improve your mindset during the game?? Yes

*If you train with 40 plus blokes twice a week does this help more so than training with 12 players twice or once a week?? I have had expereince with both and the answer is yes. Does this improve your mind set going into games?? Yes

*Do your team mates respect you more on and off field field if you train twice a week?? Absolutely

The more boxes you tick mentally the bigger edge you give yourself to win. The more you train together the more you get to know each other. The more you know each other the more you know what your team mates are capable of. If you tick every box then the more you beleive you can win @ any stage of the game (Feeling bullet proof).

I'm lucky enough to have played in a premiership and the arrogance of knowing you can win @ any stage of the game is the number 1 key to success....Done with bloody hard work.

If you can pay for a phsyc to mentally give you these advantages well go ahead. Or you can just train twice a week and do your health some good aswell.

Yeeesss!!!!!! A premiership player who gets it.

[zedman]

Geez wasn't expecting this sort of response,afta reading all this I think morell is right and zed is wrong all I know is when your in your 30's u are still bloody sore on a Tuesday nite but by Thursday your fresh and ready to go

so i was wrong on all my points??..or which ones? your fresh to go thursday because you did something on the tuesday!

[zedman]

Cast aside all the sports science theories, we all know amateur football is mind over matter and even AFL.

*If you beleive you are fitter than your opponent does this improve your mindset during the game?? Yes

*If you train with 40 plus blokes twice a week does this help more so than training with 12 players twice or once a week?? I have had expereince with both and the answer is yes. Does this improve your mind set going into games?? Yes

*Do your team mates respect you more on and off field field if you train twice a week?? Absolutely

The more boxes you tick mentally the bigger edge you give yourself to win. The more you train together the more you get to know each other. The more you know each other the more you know what your team mates are capable of. If you tick every box then the more you beleive you can win @ any stage of the game (Feeling bullet proof).

I'm lucky enough to have played in a premiership and the arrogance of knowing you can win @ any stage of the game is the number 1 key to success....Done with bloody hard work.

If you can pay for a phsyc to mentally give you these advantages well go ahead. Or you can just train twice a week and do your health some good aswell.

Yeeesss!!!!!! A premiership player who gets it.

well said LK

[morell]

So the argument has been reduced down to essentially, a strange mixture of culture, respect and a mental strength quasi placebo effect?

This was thrust of my main point before zed, these theories, sayings and football truisms;

"mind over matter"
"play the way you train"
"training improves your mindset"
"run the sore spots out"
"knowing youre fitter than the opposition"

Etc etc etc, we all know of 10 we could reel off...

Is there any empirical evidence to support them or is it all just anecdotal? Are they a one size fits all rule or are people just making assumptions on their own experiences?

Just like in Moneyball and baseball with their toolkit players, good faces and decades old ways of doing things, someone, will find a different way to do things smarter, better and with great success...

[Freo HeaveHo]

Im gonna stop reading this thread Morell if you continue to use words and structure your sentences so the everyday brain dead footballer can understand. I have to read your posts five times for it to sink in

[zedman]

http://au.fourfourtwo.com/news/227143,j ... ntent+Feed

"I want to make them warriors ... they need to adopt that warrior mentality, but if they don't buy into it it's not going to work," Kosmina said.

"I hope to turn it around, I think I can and I will back myself in at it, but it comes down to the players. If they want to turn it around then we will turn it around but they have to buy into it.

"Coaches can help players with their motivation ... but they have to be intrinsically motivated and really look what's inside themselves otherwise you're not going to be successful."

Kosmina oversaw his first training session on Monday in what was an intense run-out for the Reds, with a number of players looking visibly passionate and spirited.

The former Brisbane Strikers coach delivered an inspiring speech prior to the session stressing the need for the players to show purpose and fight on the training ground.

An experienced Socceroo in his playing days, Kosmina said maintaining consistent intensity in training was the key to achieving results.

"They must train with purpose because for me training is what it's all about. If you don't train well you're never going to play well, ever," Kosmina said.

"You get out of it what you put into it and I don't think that ever changes ... if you don't get stuck in and have a go you're not going to get a result or be successful.

another guy who has got it wrong eh?

[morell]

zedman, that's practically a PR statement/propaganda for the fans to eat and absorb so they follow the flag.

and

its all anecdotal!

What is the empirical evidence behind the "warrior mentality", "buy into it", "maintaining consistent intensity", "get out of it what you put into it" statments. Or are they just empty words for the pundits?

[morell]

Im gonna stop reading this thread Morell if you continue to use words and structure your sentences so the everyday brain dead footballer can understand. I have to read your posts five times for it to sink in

haha sorry mate,

In summary all I am saying is there is a lot of old school football myths that may or may not actually be founded in fact. "You must train twice a week to be a successful Div 7 footballer" is one of them.

We need a football version of Mythbusters.

[GHS#33]

There is a clear and obvious positive correlation between training and game day performance. I don’t need to thrash Google Scholar to support this, it is common sense that if you aren’t training then your physical condition will decline or remain at a sub-standard level to those that are training. Hence, if you are playing footy at a fitness level below that of your opposition then you are going to struggle.

[Footy Chick]

Im gonna stop reading this thread Morell if you continue to use words and structure your sentences so the everyday brain dead footballer can understand. I have to read your posts five times for it to sink in

haha sorry mate,

In summary all I am saying is there is a lot of old school football myths that may or may not actually be founded in fact. "You must train twice a week to be a successful Div 7 footballer" is one of them.

We need a football version of Mythbusters.

I'd be in that

[zedman]

There is a clear and obvious positive correlation between training and game day performance. I don’t need to thrash Google Scholar to support this, it is common sense that if you aren’t training then your physical condition will decline or remain at a sub-standard level to those that are training. Hence, if you are playing footy at a fitness level below that of your opposition then you are going to struggle.

[Q.]

Im gonna stop reading this thread Morell if you continue to use words and structure your sentences so the everyday brain dead footballer can understand. I have to read your posts five times for it to sink in

haha sorry mate,

In summary all I am saying is there is a lot of old school football myths that may or may not actually be founded in fact. "You must train twice a week to be a successful Div 7 footballer" is one of them.

We need a football version of Mythbusters.

I'd be in that

Is that your $0.02?

[zedman]

zedman, that's practically a PR statement/propaganda for the fans to eat and absorb so they follow the flag.

and

its all anecdotal!

What is the empirical evidence behind the "warrior mentality", "buy into it", "maintaining consistent intensity", "get out of it what you put into it" statments. Or are they just empty words for the pundits?

no morell..kosmina believes it and he lives it..and look at the turn around since he took over..i can find plenty of other successful coaches who will say exactly the same thing but you know better..

[morell]

There is a clear and obvious positive correlation between training and game day performance. I don’t need to thrash Google Scholar to support this, it is common sense that if you aren’t training then your physical condition will decline or remain at a sub-standard level to those that are training. Hence, if you are playing footy at a fitness level below that of your opposition then you are going to struggle.

^^ This ignores the assumption that the person involved has done a pre-season, is naturally fit, strong and can play football and makes another one that all players are created equal with the same benchmark in terms of fitness and ability. Using your logic and taking it to the extreme:

If Gary Ablett Jr quit Gold Coast, joined up with Mitchell Park in Div 7, but only trained once a week, how do you reckon he would go?

[marbles]

Team A and its 21 players might run a combined total of 79km throughout the game

team B might run combined total of 52km

who wins

[morell]

zedman, that's practically a PR statement/propaganda for the fans to eat and absorb so they follow the flag.

and

its all anecdotal!

What is the empirical evidence behind the "warrior mentality", "buy into it", "maintaining consistent intensity", "get out of it what you put into it" statments. Or are they just empty words for the pundits?

no morell..kosmina believes it and he lives it..and look at the turn around since he took over..i can find plenty of other successful coaches who will say exactly the same thing but you know better..

And every one of those examples would be anecdotal! As is John Kosmina turning around Adelaide United. You're either not listening or you don't understand what anecdotal evidence means.

It is considered evidence, although often dubious if accepted often because it is the only evidence we have. However it may itself be true and verifiable.
The term is often used in contrast to scientific evidence... Misuse of anecdotal evidence is a logical fallacy and is sometimes informally referred to as the "person who" fallacy ("I know a person who..."; "I know of a case where..." etc. Anecdotal evidence is not necessarily representative of a "typical" experience; statistical evidence can more accurately determine how typical something is.

Accounts of direct personal experience are commonly equated to anecdotal evidence where the evidence is anecdote, hearsay or represents a conclusion deduced from generalisation. Unlike anecdotal evidence, the reliability of accounts of personal experience is normally capable of assessment for legal proceedings.
When used in advertising or promotion of a product, service, or idea, anecdotal reports are often called a testimonial, which are banned in some jurisdictions.[citation needed] The term is also sometimes used in a legal context to describe certain kinds of testimony. Psychologists have found that people are more likely to remember notable examples than typical examples.

[Footy Chick]

Im gonna stop reading this thread Morell if you continue to use words and structure your sentences so the everyday brain dead footballer can understand. I have to read your posts five times for it to sink in

haha sorry mate,

In summary all I am saying is there is a lot of old school football myths that may or may not actually be founded in fact. "You must train twice a week to be a successful Div 7 footballer" is one of them.

We need a football version of Mythbusters.

I'd be in that

Is that your $0.02?

No, I havent had time to read it all properly yet

PS: isnt it funny how a (probably too) intellectual conversation can go downhill in 2 posts.

Give it a rest Hotpies and Z...

[zedman]

zedman, that's practically a PR statement/propaganda for the fans to eat and absorb so they follow the flag.

and

its all anecdotal!

What is the empirical evidence behind the "warrior mentality", "buy into it", "maintaining consistent intensity", "get out of it what you put into it" statments. Or are they just empty words for the pundits?

no morell..kosmina believes it and he lives it..and look at the turn around since he took over..i can find plenty of other successful coaches who will say exactly the same thing but you know better..

And every one of those examples would be anecdotal! As is John Kosmina turning around Adelaide United. You're either not listening or you don't understand what anecdotal evidence means.

It is considered evidence, although often dubious if accepted often because it is the only evidence we have. However it may itself be true and verifiable.
The term is often used in contrast to scientific evidence... Misuse of anecdotal evidence is a logical fallacy and is sometimes informally referred to as the "person who" fallacy ("I know a person who..."; "I know of a case where..." etc. Anecdotal evidence is not necessarily representative of a "typical" experience; statistical evidence can more accurately determine how typical something is.

Accounts of direct personal experience are commonly equated to anecdotal evidence where the evidence is anecdote, hearsay or represents a conclusion deduced from generalisation. Unlike anecdotal evidence, the reliability of accounts of personal experience is normally capable of assessment for legal proceedings.
When used in advertising or promotion of a product, service, or idea, anecdotal reports are often called a testimonial, which are banned in some jurisdictions.[citation needed] The term is also sometimes used in a legal context to describe certain kinds of testimony. Psychologists have found that people are more likely to remember notable examples than typical examples.

kosmina turning the reds around is not anecdotal..its factual..look where they were under coolen and look where they are now.. nothing anecdotal at all.. statistically proven..go look at a premiership table

http://www.footballaustralia.com.au/aleague