SAAFL Division 7 & D7R (2012)

[marbles]

Well no way would foxtel hav mitchell park jumper on tv, the henley flinders although is a great day of history and rivalry is only C grade teams, the shoc game will be a shilacking, the modbury north pines could be good but yeah might be right on angle vale ttg game but ttg is a c grade team too.

My vote is sharks vs parks as game of the round

[story of my life]

Well no way would foxtel hav mitchell park jumper on tv, the henley flinders although is a great day of history and rivalry is only C grade teams, the shoc game will be a shilacking, the modbury north pines could be good but yeah might be right on angle vale ttg game but ttg is a c grade team too.

My vote is sharks vs parks as game of the round

It would be better than most of the stuff they show on foxtel

[zedman]

Pretty sure Pines lost Sansbury and Newchurch*2 as well no? And would that mean Rigney an unlikely starter also?

Not sure about Sansbury but I've heard after months of shopping himself around and not being able to find a club that suits his 'lack of training' ethic along with the money he asked for D.Newchurch has decided to stay at North Pines and may only play B Grade with his brothers.

sansbury at kenilworth..

[Footy Chick]

havent we already had this conversation?

[supersonicgun]

Pretty sure Pines lost Sansbury and Newchurch*2 as well no? And would that mean Rigney an unlikely starter also?

Not sure about Sansbury but I've heard after months of shopping himself around and not being able to find a club that suits his 'lack of training' ethic along with the money he asked for D.Newchurch has decided to stay at North Pines and may only play B Grade with his brothers.

sansbury at kenilworth..

Newchurch worth the money mate kpp who can play at both ends of the ground,when u get older training 1 nite a week is quite sufficient if u have a good fitness base to begin with

[Yank Man]

1 night a week ain't gonna cut the mustard to be in the top three regardless of you fitness base in this Div. That would not have happened at the top 4 clubs in 2011. The good coaches with depth will demand more.

[moriachi]

The best players are generally between the ages of 23 & 30. Training twice a week should be no sweat.

[Yank Man]

The best players are generally between the ages of 23 & 30. Training twice a week should be no sweat.

100% agree. With a good blend of 18 to 23 y.o. who are mostly quick and don't lack courage against the bodies.

[morell]

The best players are generally between the ages of 23 & 30. Training twice a week should be no sweat.

I'm 28 and am 1/4 the player I reckon I was at 20-21 (not that I was ever much chop )

Youth, endurance and a relatively injury free body are massively important.

[Freo HeaveHo]

1 night a week ain't gonna cut the mustard to be in the top three regardless of you fitness base in this Div. That would not have happened at the top 4 clubs in 2011. The good coaches with depth will demand more.

I disagree ... for instance if i a top side in this div had say a handful of their top players unable to train one night of the week it wouldnt affect them at all in my opinion. The difference between the top sides in these lower divisions is depth of players and that is all. Nearly all of the sides last few picked players are never going to be superstars no matter how hard you train.

I grew up playing in a league that only trained once a week , that team was all of the 23-27 age bracket pretty much so everyone was of a decent fitness level. And im no champion player myself but have played in a few sides with some great players but still rate that side as good as any i have been involved with. I guess im of the opinion that from a skills perspective you can only improve so much .

I guess my point it is ........ how long have we been kicking a footy for ?? since we were old enough to pick one up....... If you cant kick one now is training one night more a week going to make that big a difference ???

[morell]

1 night a week ain't gonna cut the mustard to be in the top three regardless of you fitness base in this Div. That would not have happened at the top 4 clubs in 2011. The good coaches with depth will demand more.

I disagree ... for instance if i a top side in this div had say a handful of their top players unable to train one night of the week it wouldnt affect them at all in my opinion. The difference between the top sides in these lower divisions is depth of players and that is all. Nearly all of the sides last few picked players are never going to be superstars no matter how hard you train.

I grew up playing in a league that only trained once a week , that team was all of the 23-27 age bracket pretty much so everyone was of a decent fitness level. And im no champion player myself but have played in a few sides with some great players but still rate that side as good as any i have been involved with. I guess im of the opinion that from a skills perspective you can only improve so much .

I guess my point it is ........ how long have we been kicking a footy for ?? since we were old enough to pick one up....... If you cant kick one now is training one night more a week going to make that big a difference ???

I'm with Freo - training is not as essential nor does it do as much for some, particularly with older guys it isn't going to make much difference. I know personally it wouldn't matter if I trained 3 times a week for 6 months straight, I still wouldn't have the aerobic capacity of others, nor the skill - if anything it would be to the detriment of my football as the wear and tear on the body would mean restriction on Saturdays. It really is dependent on the individual athlete. [/excuses to get out of training]

The more important thing about training is probably the team bonding/tactics/game plan/methodology aspects.

but I must disagree one one thing Freo - that you're not a champion player.

[story of my life]

1 night a week ain't gonna cut the mustard to be in the top three regardless of you fitness base in this Div. That would not have happened at the top 4 clubs in 2011. The good coaches with depth will demand more.

I disagree ... for instance if i a top side in this div had say a handful of their top players unable to train one night of the week it wouldnt affect them at all in my opinion. The difference between the top sides in these lower divisions is depth of players and that is all. Nearly all of the sides last few picked players are never going to be superstars no matter how hard you train.

I grew up playing in a league that only trained once a week , that team was all of the 23-27 age bracket pretty much so everyone was of a decent fitness level. And im no champion player myself but have played in a few sides with some great players but still rate that side as good as any i have been involved with. I guess im of the opinion that from a skills perspective you can only improve so much .

I guess my point it is ........ how long have we been kicking a footy for ?? since we were old enough to pick one up....... If you cant kick one now is training one night more a week going to make that big a difference ???

I'm with Freo - training is not as essential nor does it do as much for some, particularly with older guys it isn't going to make much difference. I know personally it wouldn't matter if I trained 3 times a week for 6 months straight, I still wouldn't have the aerobic capacity of others, nor the skill - if anything it would be to the detriment of my football as the wear and tear on the body would mean restriction on Saturdays. It really is dependent on the individual athlete. [/excuses to get out of training]

The more important thing about training is probably the team bonding/tactics/game plan/methodology aspects.

but I must disagree one one thing Freo - that you're not a champion player.

Morrell championing the cause for training one night a week... who would have thought. And Freo has more chance of owning a champion grey hound than being a champion player

[zedman]

amateur players only need to train 1 night but AFL players train 5-6 days a week and they are the best??..something dont add up..ALL players can always improve some part of their game because if they were perfect they would be playing at another level..you play the way you train..its pure laziness to only want to train once a week..

[morell]

..you play the way you train..

One of, if not the biggest myths in football.

[morell]

Morrell championing the cause for training one night a week... who would have thought. And Freo has more chance of owning a champion grey hound than being a champion player

hahah, can only speak from personal experience and observations. Training is massively overrated at our level. All it does for me is increase the likelihood of inflaming a chronic injury.

Also note that I am assuming that one would have an existing fitness base - which of course I dont! haha

... and Freo is still the most naturally talented footballer I have ever played with.

[zedman]

..you play the way you train..

One of, if not the biggest myths in football.

pfft..i hope thats sarcasm..one day you should coach a senior team morell and see if you agree then with what you are saying..because you wont..

so they can train once a week and train anyway they want, with perhaps circle work for 1 hour?, with any sort of crap attitude or slackness and you will still win games..lol..yeah, you might beat the scrubbers on talent only but thats it..

[Q.]

If anything, training is underrated at this level. Most blokes aren't going go out during the week and do their own fitness training to maintain their aerobic capacity they've gained from a pre-season, so from that point of view, one training a week is not enough. From an observational point of view, it's always been obvious that the blokes who consistently train both nights a week at a good intensity are the ones who have a higher endurance and ability to repeat sprint on game day.

Also, the first training of the week is very good for shaking off Delayed Onset Muscle Soreness.

Two trainings also give you flexibility. Work on general team rules and structures on one night, while on the second night you can work on more specific areas like clearances and zones etc.

[morell]

..you play the way you train..

One of, if not the biggest myths in football.

pfft..i hope thats sarcasm..one day you should coach a senior team morell and see if you agree then with what you are saying..because you wont..

so they can train once a week and train anyway they want, with perhaps circle work for 1 hour?, with any sort of crap attitude or slackness and you will still win games..lol..yeah, you might beat the scrubbers on talent only but thats it..

I am reading the book Moneyball at the moment after seeing the excellent movie. The idea around it is that sabermetrics (the measuring of events in baseball accurately) was proven to be a much better method for drafting and selecting players than going on old school baseball traditions and beliefs. The concept of picking up players and/or playing them based on their facial bone structure - known has having a "Good Face" - was not uncommon.

I cannot help but think of all the utter bullshit, old school, outdated, disproven claptrap that gets purported around football clubs as an analogy. This "you play as you train" mantra being one of them.

The amount of times I have been involved in complete and utter shambles of trainings with poor numbers and then come out on Saturday and either pumped a team or won when I didn't expect to are innumerable. In addition the amount of times we have trained the house down with an army of players and performed poorly on Saturday are also innumerable. There is simply ZERO statistical correlation between training quality and gameday quality, especially given the relatively simple and basic ideas on training that most amateur clubs have.

Talent, depth, structure, discipline, game plan et al are all far more important than how many targets you hit on the chest, how many laps or pushups you did 2 days earlier.

By all means being fit and strong is important, but the assumption with the discussion above is that the particular players would already have those two boxes ticked and that training an extra night a week wont improve those qualities.

[morell]

If anything, training is underrated at this level. Most blokes aren't going go out during the week and do their own fitness training to maintain their aerobic capacity they've gained from a pre-season, so from that point of view, one training a week is not enough. From an observational point of view, it's always been obvious that the blokes who consistently train both nights a week at a good intensity are the ones who have a higher endurance and ability to repeat sprint on game day.

Yeah but are those blokes you see doing that stuff on Saturday able to do so because of their natural talents and physical attributes or because they trained hard on Tuesday? I know which one I reckon...

Correlation doesn't equal causation.

Also, the first training of the week is very good for shaking off Delayed Onset Muscle Soreness.

Have you been talking to our coach? Biggest load of rubbish I have ever heard of. It's like having sex for virginity. The only thing exercising to run out sore spots does is increase pain thresholds and tolerance. This effect is called exercise-induced analgesia. There is much evidence out there it is actually a dangerous activity and can mask injuries which can lead to more serious and permanent damage.

Just like stretching before training, ice baths and a bunch of other old school football myths, it is founded in misnomers, rumour and old wives tales.

Two trainings also give you flexibility. Work on general team rules and structures on one night, while on the second night you can work on more specific areas like clearances and zones etc.

This is agree with.

as I said before:

The more important thing about training x2 is probably the team bonding/tactics/game plan/methodology aspects.

[zedman]

Morell:what clubs have you been at beside MP to give you this well rounded view?

like i said..in the division you play in you can win some games on talent alone but you will NEVER get the ultimate success training like drunk sheep once a week..FACT

if you think your right lets see you lobby your coach to bring in 1 day a week training with no emphasis on energy, enthusiasm and skill at training..eh? will he do it? no..of course he wont because its wrong..and wont bring success..

no team wins flags without doing the work..another fact..