Adelaide Season 2011

[cripple]

Have just completed the 4 hour drive home after a loss this season for the 5th time and much the same story. Thought Douglas played well early and some good signs from callinan, trenks and sammy jacobs at times but our lack of pace and endeavour is really concerning. At the opening bounce kurt tippett had both Scarlett and Taylor hanging all over him and was never going to have a chance.
Every time we won a clearance in the middle it would always go to the same spot in the right forward pocket. geelong could just wait for that clearance and set up their attack from the same point every time. From my seat it appeared as though Jacobs won his share of taps and a crow would get hands on it first, but the cats players were smart enough to stay out of the contest and pick off the ball when it bumbled out.
In the 2nd half it started to look as though craigy was trying out a few things such as Gunstan down forward and johncock further up the ground which is hopefully a sign of things to come.
In regards to adelaides youth being no good, that opinion is fine at the moment but with absolutely no leadership from our so called senior players (Reilly, Knights, VB, doughty) i dont think there is much more they can do. Youngsters need help from their senior players and if those senior players are not up to scratch, the youth have no chance unless they went top 10 in the draft. Everyone talks about the never ending youth at your geelongs, collingwoods and even sydney that comes from being placed into an established team. We are not playing well enough at the moment but this period of hardship is going to make the crows a better team in years to come.

[redden whites]

[whufc]

I base alot of my judgement on the Adelaide youth by the fact barely any of them are 'elite' players in the SANFL nevermind being good AFL players.

[cripple]

Very few of adelaides guns in the history of the club were guns in the sanfl before hand. Obviously the initial squad is a different case but the likes of Goodwin, Edwards, Roo, Bickley and Smart gained their footy education playing AFL football instead of SANFL football. In recent years there has been too many players for both the crows and power that are guns/ very good players at SANFL level (walker, symes, adam thomson a few years back) but can not cut it at AFL level. Whilst ideally the 23-28th best players at the crows would be dominating sanfl ranks this just isn't the case with the current squad. The likes of Thompson, Petrenko, Sloane, McKernan, Henderson and Jaensch are going to gain faster development in terms of required game plans and fitness playing for the crows at the moment then they could ever hope to get playing SANFL footy.

[whufc]

Very few of adelaides guns in the history of the club were guns in the sanfl before hand. Obviously the initial squad is a different case but the likes of Goodwin, Edwards, Roo, Bickley and Smart gained their footy education playing AFL football instead of SANFL football. In recent years there has been too many players for both the crows and power that are guns/ very good players at SANFL level (walker, symes, adam thomson a few years back) but can not cut it at AFL level. Whilst ideally the 23-28th best players at the crows would be dominating sanfl ranks this just isn't the case with the current squad. The likes of Thompson, Petrenko, Sloane, McKernan, Henderson and Jaensch are going to gain faster development in terms of required game plans and fitness playing for the crows at the moment then they could ever hope to get playing SANFL footy.

True but i guess my point is more that the likes of Petrenko, Jaensch, Sellar, were never even good SANFL players to get on the Crows list in the first place.

The rest of the group, most have shown absolutely nothing at SANFL level that suggests they will become good players at a higher level.

No surprise to see Callinan come straight in and play better than the rest of the spuds he has dominated against in the SANFL for years now.

Much much much better footballers getting around in the SANFL that the Crows have missed out on. Same goes for the Power.

[Gingernuts]

Sure there's some dead wood, but to dismiss blokes like Sloane, Petrenko, Dangerfield, Otten, L Thompson, Tippett, Walker, McKernan, Jaench, Martin, Smith, et al on the merit of 0 - 80 games is ludicrous.

I can safely dismiss half that lot you mentioned. The other half are 50/50.

This is the problem with the Crows. They think some of these blokes will become something. The Crows remind me of Richmond a few years back. Carrying some duds for too long.

I will safely disagree with you.

Again I repeat my original statement - to dismiss a player with 0 - 80 games under the belt is ludicrous. Thank **** none of you fellas are in charge of an AFL list.

Dale Thomas was as frustrating as hell when he first started. Steve Johnson wasn't worth a pinch of shit for a long time. Mark Ricciuto was a muscle bound nuffy in his first few years. By your criteria these blokes would have been thrown on the scrapheap well before they reached their full potential.

Very few players are out and out champions from the get go. I have faith in this list. They need to be kept together and given a fighting chance, not chopped up and thrown on the scrapheap before they've had a decent crack.

[whufc]

Sure there's some dead wood, but to dismiss blokes like Sloane, Petrenko, Dangerfield, Otten, L Thompson, Tippett, Walker, McKernan, Jaench, Martin, Smith, et al on the merit of 0 - 80 games is ludicrous.

I can safely dismiss half that lot you mentioned. The other half are 50/50.

This is the problem with the Crows. They think some of these blokes will become something. The Crows remind me of Richmond a few years back. Carrying some duds for too long.

I will safely disagree with you.

Again I repeat my original statement - to dismiss a player with 0 - 80 games under the belt is ludicrous. Thank **** none of you fellas are in charge of an AFL list.

Dale Thomas was as frustrating as hell when he first started. Steve Johnson wasn't worth a pinch of **** for a long time. Mark Ricciuto was a muscle bound nuffy in his first few years. By your criteria these blokes would have been thrown on the scrapheap well before they reached their full potential.

Very few players are out and out champions from the get go. I have faith in this list. They need to be kept together and given a fighting chance, not chopped up and thrown on the scrapheap before they've had a decent crack.

So if i was on an AFL list you would give me 80 games to prove im not even up to div 7 amatuer level.

Some of these blokes have done nothin/zero to even be on an AFL list, Dale Thomas and Stevie J from what i heard where very good underage players and starred in TEAC Cup (is that whats its called).

Some of these Crows blokes have been spuds for much longer than just the time they have been on an AFL list.

[Media Park]

Ian Callinan- Did alright for his first game. Realistically at 28 he's only got a three or four years at this level, but hopefully what he did today was a benchmark for him.
Patrick Dangerfield- future star, but next year he's at GWS.
Michael Doughty- Drop him now.
Richard Douglas- See Doughty.
Jack Gunston- See Douglas.
Ricky Henderson- Does enough. Will not be an out-and-out superstar, but will hold his place at AFL level, and will get an extended run because he's at Adelaide... Hopefully he plays in a more successful Crows outfit in time.
Sam Jacobs- Went alright against Simpson and Hawkins, put him against Ottens/Vardy or NicNat/Cox or Sandilands and he's toast. Will only play because there is no-one better.
Graham Johncock- One of the veterans they need to build this team around.
Chris Knights- Too inconsistent for this level.
Shaun McKernan- See Gunston.
Andy Otten- Shining light. Under no circumstances can the Crows lose this guy.
Jared Petrenko- See McKernan.
Brent Reilly- Honestly, two years ago I would have said he's going to be a gun, now I'm thinking he could be the next Michael Doughty.
Ben Rutten- The real on-field leader. This guy just keeps on doing his thing.
Christopher Schmidt- See Petrenko.
Rory Sloane- Goes alright, holds his spot, and we'll see if he takes his game to the next level.
Luke Thompson- Absolute gem. He will be a 250 gamer.
Scott Thompson- Their best player. Should have been captain. He is a champ.
Kurt Tippett- Hot and cold. Can be the difference... Can also lose his team the game... Would love to see him get more consistent.
Bernie Vince- See Reilly.
Matthew Wright- Needs a few solid games. I really think he can play, but if they want to improve next year, then he might suffer a harsh call.
Nathan van Berlo- See Vince.

Now I'm not trying to have a dig, it's just an IMO assessment of the side they played today.

[Gingernuts]

Disagree with:

Gunston - far to early to make any type of call
Jacobs - doing some good things IMO. Will get better.
McKernan - will be a very decent player. Has mongrel, something many of his teammates are lacking in.
Petrenko - think he'll do alright if he can string some games together without injury.

Otherwises a reasonable assessment MP.

[JK]

In defence of the Sellar selection, he was a highly touted junior, and on the back of one half of footy at the Parade many moons ago I thought this kid would have had a huge AFL career ahead of him ... It didn't take long to realise this wasn't going to be the case and perhaps that's one of the Crows undoings - They give players too long in many instances, to become nothing more than a "useful" type.

Of their senior players, Doughty, Reilly, Douglas have only ever been average players at best IMHO .. Some of the kids might be better performers with better players around them, but Reilly and Douglas weren't anything special even when McLeod, Ricciutio, Goodwin et al were still running around.

Lord knows where the next legitimate Crows "champion" is likely to come from .. You would think the draft, but they're just as likely to land a quality pick 8, laud some poor kid as the next coming, expecting him to solve world poverty en route to multiple flags. They will then scratch their heads in bewilderment as to why he can't get out of Adelaide quick enough when his contract expires.

[Dutchy]

Mark Ricciuto was a muscle bound nuffy in his first few years.

Wow, a nuffy that won All Australian in his second year of AFL?

[Media Park]

Mark Ricciuto was a muscle bound nuffy in his first few years.

Wow, a nuffy that won All Australian in his second year of AFL?

Well Woewodin won a Brownlow and he's a consistent name in the worst afl players thread...

[Sojourner]

Chris McDermott was on 5AA this morning calling for Craig to fall on his sword and step aside into another role at the club and for the club to put Mark Bickley in the Senior Coaching Postion for the rest of the season.

Think its a pretty safe bet somehow that it wont happen any time soon!

Not sure what Bicks would bring to the club, if Craig does get stood down, what is the point of putting one of his protege's in his place?

[Psyber]

I'm not so convinced the problem is in the players themselves, but in the very difficult and demanding game style, that some of them just can't deliver the goods in.
The style needs to be changed to fit the material available if that material is all you have to work with.
That emphasis on running seemed to work in the early years when the Crows had a fitness edge and caught a few teams by surprise as a result.
I think a different perspective like that Malcolm Blight brought with him when he arrived is now due, and a similar clean out of the old culture.

[Voice]

Very few of adelaides guns in the history of the club were guns in the sanfl before hand. Obviously the initial squad is a different case but the likes of Goodwin, Edwards, Roo, Bickley and Smart gained their footy education playing AFL football instead of SANFL football. In recent years there has been too many players for both the crows and power that are guns/ very good players at SANFL level (walker, symes, adam thomson a few years back) but can not cut it at AFL level. Whilst ideally the 23-28th best players at the crows would be dominating sanfl ranks this just isn't the case with the current squad. The likes of Thompson, Petrenko, Sloane, McKernan, Henderson and Jaensch are going to gain faster development in terms of required game plans and fitness playing for the crows at the moment then they could ever hope to get playing SANFL footy.

True but i guess my point is more that the likes of Petrenko, Jaensch, Sellar, were never even good SANFL players to get on the Crows list in the first place.

The rest of the group, most have shown absolutely nothing at SANFL level that suggests they will become good players at a higher level.

No surprise to see Callinan come straight in and play better than the rest of the spuds he has dominated against in the SANFL for years now.

Much much much better footballers getting around in the SANFL that the Crows have missed out on. Same goes for the Power.

I would agree with you about Petrenko and Sellar, not Jaensch though. He dominated plenty of games, especially in the season before the cows picked him up.

[Dutchy]

ive been saying it for 3-4 years now Craig is no good, interesting to see plenty of injuries AGAIN this season....it cant be a coincidence....

[Hondo]

ive been saying it for 3-4 years now Craig is no good, interesting to see plenty of injuries AGAIN this season....it cant be a coincidence....

Their injury list currently and throughout the year has not been markedly outside the norm. Compared to some teams like Freo we are doing well.

[Gingernuts]

I have a theory about our injury's over the last couple of seasons.

Matt Rendell likes to draft players who have slipped down the draft order due to perceptions about them being injury prone. He does this to maximise Adelaide's traditionally middle of the road picks and still get some bang for buck. It's a method that I quite like, however could we be paying for this now with some players living up to their pre-draft perceptions??

While we are on recruiting, I think a lot of Adelaide's current problems can be traced back to James Fantasia's last couple of years as recruitment manager. Adelaide's main issues are with their 100 - 200 gamers in my opinion. Vince, Douglas, Doughty, Van Berlo, Reilly - all are basically the same style of player, that is - mid sized 'meh'.

Rendell has been on deck since 2007, and I believe our recruiting has been much better since then.

[Hondo]

Injury runs are also cyclical. Dutchy usually goes quiet when the Crows injury list is down and then comes out crowing when there is some injury news. I think most times I have checked when he makes this repeated claim his own Kangaroos have had a number of injured players. If any club seems to cop more injuries than another I would guess at Fremantle. The other shocking runs I can recall are Hawthorn and West Coast last year. Even the Hawks this year have had a bad run but when you look at the injury lists for all teams they are similar in length.

[gossipgirl]

i cant see us winning another game for the whole year. suspect we will finish bottom.

we will even struggle against the bye