by The Bedge » Fri Nov 11, 2016 11:17 am
Dolphin Treasure wrote:Your an attention seeking embarsement..
by Jimmy_041 » Fri Nov 11, 2016 12:34 pm
The realities of office are that he has to deal with two houses of congress, and the agenda he spruiked won't be as easy to implement with the mere stroke of a pen at the Oval Office
by bulldogproud » Fri Nov 11, 2016 12:51 pm
Magellan wrote:I have theory about how the Trump presidency is going to unfold. I reckon there's a good chance he's not going to honour the inflammatory language and protectionist/nationalist policies that marked the election campaign. In fact, I'd say he's likely to turn out to be quite an ineffective and lame president that falls short what he said he'd do.
The realities of office are that he has to deal with two houses of congress, and the agenda he spruiked won't be as easy to implement with the mere stroke of a pen at the Oval Office. You might say that Trump can't afford to not implement his controversial policies, because it would piss off the masses of rust-belt disaffected middle Americans who adopted Trump as their idol and savior from a modern world they see as having left them behind. They've invested themselves, their personal hopes and dreams for a better future into his idea of making America great again. They made him, and they'll be baying for his blood if he doesn't honour his suite of promises to build the Mexican wall, kick out all the Muslims, nuke Syria, bring back jobs and impose tariffs etc. He would become another member of the political establishment, someone who promises everything but fell short, just like all the other members of the political elite.
I say Trump, unlike all other presidential candidates (and political candidates), doesn't care about what he's going to do as president. He only cares about being the president. Like all massively successful male white businessmen, it's all about the contest. Trump, Murdoch, Packer, or whoever else don't take over companies and build extravagant buildings because their family will starve if they don't. They don't need the money. For them, business is a sport. It's about winning, the thrill of the chase and getting the trophy. Once you've won the match, you can point to the trophy. You have bragging rights. I won, you lost. The presidency is another trophy for Trump to put in his cabinet and point to in case you don't think he's a really smart and super awesome guy. He doesn't want to exercise the power, because he doesn't know what to do with it, as evidenced by a campaign that focused on why you should vote for him (or no Hillary) as opposed to outlining a clear agenda for what he was going to do when he got there.
The same way that people invest money in Trump's businesses and schemes is no different to the emotional and philosophical investment that people have made in his message. Trump's no stranger in the business world to taking people's investments and burning them for his own benefit, and walking away from the mess whilst telling everyone how great he still is. Trump's legacy to date has not been about it's substance, its all about style (for want of a better word) and vanity. There's no reason to suggest this is going to change.
I can hear Trump in four year's time, having been defeated in a landslide election, answering to his angry rust-belt supporters. They'll say, "Trump, you were a shit president and a liar because you reneged on all your policies that were going to start a revolution. You're just like all the other politicians. We believed in you, and you took us for a ride, **** you." And Trump will reply with his trademark smug grin and shrugged shoulders, "Hey, guess what? I got to be the president, and you didn't. Thanks for getting me there, it was a real blast to be the most powerful man in the world."
Of course, if this pans out like this it won't address the core issues at the heart of democratic politics in the US and the exclusion of large numbers of the disaffected. In fact it'll probably exacerbate it, but that's the last thing on Trump's mind, safe in his ivory tower in Manhattan and satisfied with his most prized trophy.
by stan » Fri Nov 11, 2016 2:40 pm
bulldogproud wrote:Magellan wrote:I have theory about how the Trump presidency is going to unfold. I reckon there's a good chance he's not going to honour the inflammatory language and protectionist/nationalist policies that marked the election campaign. In fact, I'd say he's likely to turn out to be quite an ineffective and lame president that falls short what he said he'd do.
The realities of office are that he has to deal with two houses of congress, and the agenda he spruiked won't be as easy to implement with the mere stroke of a pen at the Oval Office. You might say that Trump can't afford to not implement his controversial policies, because it would piss off the masses of rust-belt disaffected middle Americans who adopted Trump as their idol and savior from a modern world they see as having left them behind. They've invested themselves, their personal hopes and dreams for a better future into his idea of making America great again. They made him, and they'll be baying for his blood if he doesn't honour his suite of promises to build the Mexican wall, kick out all the Muslims, nuke Syria, bring back jobs and impose tariffs etc. He would become another member of the political establishment, someone who promises everything but fell short, just like all the other members of the political elite.
I say Trump, unlike all other presidential candidates (and political candidates), doesn't care about what he's going to do as president. He only cares about being the president. Like all massively successful male white businessmen, it's all about the contest. Trump, Murdoch, Packer, or whoever else don't take over companies and build extravagant buildings because their family will starve if they don't. They don't need the money. For them, business is a sport. It's about winning, the thrill of the chase and getting the trophy. Once you've won the match, you can point to the trophy. You have bragging rights. I won, you lost. The presidency is another trophy for Trump to put in his cabinet and point to in case you don't think he's a really smart and super awesome guy. He doesn't want to exercise the power, because he doesn't know what to do with it, as evidenced by a campaign that focused on why you should vote for him (or no Hillary) as opposed to outlining a clear agenda for what he was going to do when he got there.
The same way that people invest money in Trump's businesses and schemes is no different to the emotional and philosophical investment that people have made in his message. Trump's no stranger in the business world to taking people's investments and burning them for his own benefit, and walking away from the mess whilst telling everyone how great he still is. Trump's legacy to date has not been about it's substance, its all about style (for want of a better word) and vanity. There's no reason to suggest this is going to change.
I can hear Trump in four year's time, having been defeated in a landslide election, answering to his angry rust-belt supporters. They'll say, "Trump, you were a shit president and a liar because you reneged on all your policies that were going to start a revolution. You're just like all the other politicians. We believed in you, and you took us for a ride, **** you." And Trump will reply with his trademark smug grin and shrugged shoulders, "Hey, guess what? I got to be the president, and you didn't. Thanks for getting me there, it was a real blast to be the most powerful man in the world."
Of course, if this pans out like this it won't address the core issues at the heart of democratic politics in the US and the exclusion of large numbers of the disaffected. In fact it'll probably exacerbate it, but that's the last thing on Trump's mind, safe in his ivory tower in Manhattan and satisfied with his most prized trophy.
Excellent post. The signs are already there too. He has already reneged on the 'round-up of illegals' and is not stopping Islamic immigration. Both of these key promises have already been deleted from his website. Next to go will be the threat of the trade-war with China and the building of the wall.
Cheers
by bulldogproud » Fri Nov 11, 2016 11:50 pm
Zartan wrote:I'm thinking Trump will be fine as a President.. sometimes i think the media just love to beat up on people and paint a negative picture - i thought he would be a disaster at first, especially when you hear/see snippets of comments that the media chooses to play, but i sat and watched the debates in full yesterday and it's not that i like Trump so much as Hilary put me off.. reckon she's a fair snake in the grass..
by bulldogproud » Fri Nov 11, 2016 11:57 pm
Jimmy_041 wrote:Id still like him to go after the Clintons....
by bennymacca » Sat Nov 12, 2016 8:27 am
by Jimmy_041 » Sat Nov 12, 2016 9:26 am
bulldogproud wrote:Jimmy_041 wrote:Id still like him to go after the Clintons....
I don't think he would get far if he did. After all, searches of hundreds of thousands of emails have found absolutely nothing criminal about her behaviour. What she did was akin to one of us accessing our work emails through our personal computer or our phone. I am pretty sure most of us have done this at one stage or another.
Yes, in her position, it is rather careless and should not have been done... however, definitely not criminal.
If Hillary Clinton should be in jail for this, then so should every member of the LNP. It was revealed earlier this year that all parliamentary members of the LNP access their government records through their private servers.
Compare these actions against the fact that Trump has been the defendant in over 1 000 civil cases, many of which have been in relation to fraud, almost all of which he settled out of court.
Cheers
by Magellan » Sat Nov 12, 2016 9:38 am
bulldogproud wrote:Jimmy_041 wrote:Id still like him to go after the Clintons....
I don't think he would get far if he did. After all, searches of hundreds of thousands of emails have found absolutely nothing criminal about her behaviour. What she did was akin to one of us accessing our work emails through our personal computer or our phone. I am pretty sure most of us have done this at one stage or another.
Yes, in her position, it is rather careless and should not have been done... however, definitely not criminal.
If Hillary Clinton should be in jail for this, then so should every member of the LNP. It was revealed earlier this year that all parliamentary members of the LNP access their government records through their private servers.
Compare these actions against the fact that Trump has been the defendant in over 1 000 civil cases, many of which have been in relation to fraud, almost all of which he settled out of court.
Cheers
by Magellan » Sat Nov 12, 2016 9:39 am
by Jase » Sat Nov 12, 2016 10:37 am
Magellan wrote:
Clinton has been investigated over the email thing, and whether you like it or not, she has been found to have no case to answer. That's it, case closed. You can't be tried twice for the same thing. Sure, if you find extra evidence you can try to re-open the case, bit otherwise it's a no go zone.
by Magellan » Sat Nov 12, 2016 11:23 am
by therisingblues » Sat Nov 12, 2016 1:35 pm
Magellan wrote:Ross Gittins from The Age makes some interesting points in this morning's article re: what is really likely to happen during his presidency.
http://www.theage.com.au/business/world ... smvx3.html
I think this hits the nail on the head
They voted for him because, in their anger with the business and political establishment, they wanted to give the system a kick up the bum. The less he sounded like a proper politician, the more they thought him the man for that job.
by LaughingKookaburra » Sat Nov 12, 2016 10:30 pm
by therisingblues » Sat Nov 12, 2016 10:40 pm
by LaughingKookaburra » Sat Nov 12, 2016 10:55 pm
by therisingblues » Sun Nov 13, 2016 12:00 am
by LaughingKookaburra » Sun Nov 13, 2016 12:23 am
by therisingblues » Sun Nov 13, 2016 1:28 am
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