Magarey Medal 2008

[sturtpeter]

[Big Phil]

Luke Crane is the most outstanding player in the SANFL this year.

A quality person to boot

I agree that Crane is a quality footballer and no doubt a top bloke... BUT...

Sturtpeter, surely it is way too soon to be making that kind of comment... ?

I'm sure there are ample arguments for "better" players running around from ALL other teams.

I've often wondered why Centrals, who have dominated the competition since 2000, haven't had more Magarey Medalists than just Paul Thomas, back in 2004. In my opinion, it's because we haven't had to rely on just one superstar to be succesfful. I'm sure most people would agree, the dominance of any team in any competition is NOT based on just one superstar. I guess like the old saying goes, " A champion team, not a team of champions " ....

I know that there are a few exeptions to the rule, last years winner James Allan certainly wasn't the only star in a North Adelaide gurnsey, but clearly he stood out to the umpires.

Obviously so much can happen throughout the year with injury, form slups, suspensions etc etc, and I guess we don't know exactly what the umpires contemplate when deciding their 3,2,1. Is it someone that has played a 4 quarter consistant game like Jeremy Clayton, does a 3 or 4 goal quarter from Ian Callinan that turns a game on its head get him the 3 votes ? Chambers kicks 8 but Sheedy has 42 possesions and Luke Crane plays a beauty, just have to wait and see. ???

Here are my 3 possibles and a smokey for the Magarey Medal from each team, as follows :

Centrals: Ian Callinan, Mathew Slade, Daniel Havelberg (Smokey - Leigh Westhoff)

North Adelaide: James Allen, Leigh Ryswyk, Clinton Alleway (Smokey - Rhys Archard)

Eagles: Mark McKenzie, Ben Schwarze, Luke Powell (Smokey - Leigh Treeby)

Glenelg: Brett Backwell, Adam Fisher, Justin McConnell (Smokey - Ben Kane)

Sturt: Jade Sheedy, Ian Perrie, Brant Chambers (Smokey - Luke Crane)

Port Adelaide: Jeremy Clayton, Corey Ahchee, Steve Summerton (Smokey - Harry Miller)

Norwood: James Gallagher, Scott Borlace, Brett Zorzi (Smokey - Simon Phillips)

South Adelaide: Jason Torney, Craig Parry, Matt Smith (Smokey - Ian Prendergast)

West Adelaide: Salim Hassan, Nathan Brown, Simon McCormick (Smokey - James Ezard)


I'm sure this will give people plenty of discussion points for those who agree or disagree...

GO U DOGGIES...

Big Phil...

[Grahaml]

I do agree that the best player isn't necessarily the one who gets the most votes in the magarey. If MM votes were the best measuring stick of which players were better then nobody would have anything but midfielders! Sadly when it comes to voting for individuals based on one game and who was the better player, there is no perfect way to judge it. Probably the coaches would be the best ones to decide who hurt them the most and who did their jobs the best, so B&F counts probably offer more in that sense. But how do you incorporate that into a league-wide award for one player? The current system is flawed IMHO, but less flawed than any other system I can think of or have heard of.

As for the Callinan vs Allen debate I think this is a classic case of trying to compare 2 very different footballers. Callinan the brilliant and super skilled and Allen the consistent ball magnet. I think they both suited their teams needs last season better than they would have the other way around so perhaps we might have to consider the influence of team mates in this debate as well. No good being skilled if you don't get the ball, and no good getting the ball if you haven't got the skilled players to get it out to. However, I think the style of Allen is more suited to MM votes. Callinan will flash in and out of a game doing massive damage at times, which seems to get less from the umps than the guy working all day at the bottom of the packs. 40 touches will always get you around the mark, even if those touches aren't that damaging.

[drebin]

Well summed up Graham. You are nearly 100 percent spot on with that post.

[dash61]

Ok i will play your silly games

Ladhams, Torney, Perrie, Cupiddo & Callinan

Do trial games count, Cupiddo would have polled playing back in all three???

[am Bays]

Ok i will play your silly games

Ladhams, Torney, Perrie, Cupiddo & Callinan

Do trial games count, Cupiddo would have polled playing back in all three???

Pfft not one Westies bloke would of got a vote against us, likewise not one of our players would have got a vote agaisnt Port....

[bulldogproud]

Cameron Faulkner

Are you still pissed, BP?

Of course, Centurion!

I believe that Cameron (if he ever gets out on the park) has what it takes to shine this year. Taking a bit of a roughie like Wedgie did last year.

Cheers

[bosvit]

Ok i will play your silly games

Ladhams, Torney, Perrie, Cupiddo & Callinan

Do trial games count, Cupiddo would have polled playing back in all three???

Pfft not one Westies bloke would of got a vote against us, likewise not one of our players would have got a vote agaisnt Port....

Not in the first quarter but for the rest of the game there was not much in it.

Funny how memories only use the highlights that they choose sometimes.

[bosvit]

Cupido is WAFC only chance of a MM this year IMO and he will have to have a blinder this year.

We will improve but it will be hard for anyone to win a MM from low in the five or just out of it.

[am Bays]

Ok i will play your silly games

Ladhams, Torney, Perrie, Cupiddo & Callinan

Do trial games count, Cupiddo would have polled playing back in all three???

Pfft not one Westies bloke would of got a vote against us, likewise not one of our players would have got a vote agaisnt Port....

Not in the first quarter but for the rest of the game there was not much in it.

Funny how memories only use the highlights that they choose sometimes.

Mate, I was talking the whole game he was no where near as effective as Mouse, Cranston, Holmes, Grima, Mules, Allen, Ben Kane....

He only got into the game becasue he was played in the backlines a kick behind the play due to our mid-field dominance.

[best on hill]

Go with Chambo just for fun. who was the last (if anyone) forward to kick 100 and win the Magarey?

Fred Phillis (Glenelg) 1969, I think was the last.


2008 - John Hinge

scott hodges in 1990 kicked 150

[am Bays]

Cupido is WAFC only chance of a MM this year IMO and he will have to have a blinder this year.

We will improve but it will be hard for anyone to win a MM from low in the five or just out of it.

B Phillips 1993 - North didn't make teh five
Francou 1996 - North 4th
Osborne 1998 - South didn't make teh five
Mouse 2006 - Bays 6th
Squire 1999 - Sturt 5th

[whufc]

I do agree that the best player isn't necessarily the one who gets the most votes in the magarey. If MM votes were the best measuring stick of which players were better then nobody would have anything but midfielders! Sadly when it comes to voting for individuals based on one game and who was the better player, there is no perfect way to judge it. Probably the coaches would be the best ones to decide who hurt them the most and who did their jobs the best, so B&F counts probably offer more in that sense. But how do you incorporate that into a league-wide award for one player? The current system is flawed IMHO, but less flawed than any other system I can think of or have heard of.

As for the Callinan vs Allen debate I think this is a classic case of trying to compare 2 very different footballers. Callinan the brilliant and super skilled and Allen the consistent ball magnet. I think they both suited their teams needs last season better than they would have the other way around so perhaps we might have to consider the influence of team mates in this debate as well. No good being skilled if you don't get the ball, and no good getting the ball if you haven't got the skilled players to get it out to. However, I think the style of Allen is more suited to MM votes. Callinan will flash in and out of a game doing massive damage at times, which seems to get less from the umps than the guy working all day at the bottom of the packs. 40 touches will always get you around the mark, even if those touches aren't that damaging.

Agree withevery thing you said mate IMHO Allen= a poor mans Simon Arnott. Allen rarely kicks the ball forward more than 25 meters and even when he is chipping it around sideways he is not exactly the most skilled and accuarate either.

His impact is so little on a game the Central hierarchy have not once bothered to put a tagger on him in a simliar fashion to ciccolell, let them rack up the possesions they don't create enough with the ball. Allen getting the ball 40 times will hurt you alot less than ladhams getting 15 touches.

I would take Callinan's 20 possesion 4 goal game over Allen with 21 kicks and 21 handballs 0 goals.

[drebin]

I do agree that the best player isn't necessarily the one who gets the most votes in the magarey. If MM votes were the best measuring stick of which players were better then nobody would have anything but midfielders! Sadly when it comes to voting for individuals based on one game and who was the better player, there is no perfect way to judge it. Probably the coaches would be the best ones to decide who hurt them the most and who did their jobs the best, so B&F counts probably offer more in that sense. But how do you incorporate that into a league-wide award for one player? The current system is flawed IMHO, but less flawed than any other system I can think of or have heard of.

As for the Callinan vs Allen debate I think this is a classic case of trying to compare 2 very different footballers. Callinan the brilliant and super skilled and Allen the consistent ball magnet. I think they both suited their teams needs last season better than they would have the other way around so perhaps we might have to consider the influence of team mates in this debate as well. No good being skilled if you don't get the ball, and no good getting the ball if you haven't got the skilled players to get it out to. However, I think the style of Allen is more suited to MM votes. Callinan will flash in and out of a game doing massive damage at times, which seems to get less from the umps than the guy working all day at the bottom of the packs. 40 touches will always get you around the mark, even if those touches aren't that damaging.

Agree withevery thing you said mate IMHO Allen= a poor mans Simon Arnott. Allen rarely kicks the ball forward more than 25 meters and even when he is chipping it around sideways he is not exactly the most skilled and accuarate either.

His impact is so little on a game the Central hierarchy have not once bothered to put a tagger on him in a simliar fashion to ciccolell, let them rack up the possesions they don't create enough with the ball. Allen getting the ball 40 times will hurt you alot less than ladhams getting 15 touches.

I would take Callinan's 20 possesion 4 goal game over Allen with 21 kicks and 21 handballs 0 goals.

Besides your obvious Centrals bias which is expected - most of that post is rubbish.

[G]

I know Callinan had a good year but I didnt realise he kicked 80 goals for the year [4 a game x 20]

Also Big Phil, do you undrstand the terminology of a "roughie or smokey" as blokes like Archard, Treeby, Crane and even Kane hardly fit into that category.

[wycbloods]

Luke Crane is the most outstanding player in the SANFL this year.

A quality person to boot

I agree that Crane is a quality footballer and no doubt a top bloke... BUT...

Sturtpeter, surely it is way too soon to be making that kind of comment... ?

I'm sure there are ample arguments for "better" players running around from ALL other teams.

I've often wondered why Centrals, who have dominated the competition since 2000, haven't had more Magarey Medalists than just Paul Thomas, back in 2004. In my opinion, it's because we haven't had to rely on just one superstar to be succesfful. I'm sure most people would agree, the dominance of any team in any competition is NOT based on just one superstar. I guess like the old saying goes, " A champion team, not a team of champions " ....

I know that there are a few exeptions to the rule, last years winner James Allan certainly wasn't the only star in a North Adelaide gurnsey, but clearly he stood out to the umpires.

Obviously so much can happen throughout the year with injury, form slups, suspensions etc etc, and I guess we don't know exactly what the umpires contemplate when deciding their 3,2,1. Is it someone that has played a 4 quarter consistant game like Jeremy Clayton, does a 3 or 4 goal quarter from Ian Callinan that turns a game on its head get him the 3 votes ? Chambers kicks 8 but Sheedy has 42 possesions and Luke Crane plays a beauty, just have to wait and see. ???

Here are my 3 possibles and a smokey for the Magarey Medal from each team, as follows :

Centrals: Ian Callinan, Mathew Slade, Daniel Havelberg (Smokey - Leigh Westhoff)

North Adelaide: James Allen, Leigh Ryswyk, Clinton Alleway (Smokey - Rhys Archard)

Eagles: Mark McKenzie, Ben Schwarze, Luke Powell (Smokey - Leigh Treeby)

Glenelg: Brett Backwell, Adam Fisher, Justin McConnell (Smokey - Ben Kane)

Sturt: Jade Sheedy, Ian Perrie, Brant Chambers (Smokey - Luke Crane)

Port Adelaide: Jeremy Clayton, Corey Ahchee, Steve Summerton (Smokey - Harry Miller)

Norwood: James Gallagher, Scott Borlace, Brett Zorzi (Smokey - Simon Phillips)

South Adelaide: Jason Torney, Craig Parry, Matt Smith (Smokey - Ian Prendergast)

West Adelaide: Salim Hassan, Nathan Brown, Simon McCormick (Smokey - James Ezard)


I'm sure this will give people plenty of discussion points for those who agree or disagree...

GO U DOGGIES...

Big Phil...

Craig Parry will never win a magarey. He can't go 22 games without being suspended.

[Big Phil]

Craig Parry will never win a magarey. He can't go 22 games without being suspended.

Oh yeah, I forgot about that... Shouldn't have, he's got a SHOCKING record...

Okay, replace him with, oh I don't bloody know.... Chad Norsworthy !!!!

Just joking, it's a hard one... Maybe Josh Thewlis ???????????????????????????

Big Phil...

[carey]

hassan for me lads and i hate westies !

[Aerie]

I do agree that the best player isn't necessarily the one who gets the most votes in the magarey. If MM votes were the best measuring stick of which players were better then nobody would have anything but midfielders! Sadly when it comes to voting for individuals based on one game and who was the better player, there is no perfect way to judge it. Probably the coaches would be the best ones to decide who hurt them the most and who did their jobs the best, so B&F counts probably offer more in that sense. But how do you incorporate that into a league-wide award for one player? The current system is flawed IMHO, but less flawed than any other system I can think of or have heard of.

As for the Callinan vs Allen debate I think this is a classic case of trying to compare 2 very different footballers. Callinan the brilliant and super skilled and Allen the consistent ball magnet. I think they both suited their teams needs last season better than they would have the other way around so perhaps we might have to consider the influence of team mates in this debate as well. No good being skilled if you don't get the ball, and no good getting the ball if you haven't got the skilled players to get it out to. However, I think the style of Allen is more suited to MM votes. Callinan will flash in and out of a game doing massive damage at times, which seems to get less from the umps than the guy working all day at the bottom of the packs. 40 touches will always get you around the mark, even if those touches aren't that damaging.

Agree withevery thing you said mate IMHO Allen= a poor mans Simon Arnott. Allen rarely kicks the ball forward more than 25 meters and even when he is chipping it around sideways he is not exactly the most skilled and accuarate either.

His impact is so little on a game the Central hierarchy have not once bothered to put a tagger on him in a simliar fashion to ciccolell, let them rack up the possesions they don't create enough with the ball. Allen getting the ball 40 times will hurt you alot less than ladhams getting 15 touches.

I would take Callinan's 20 possesion 4 goal game over Allen with 21 kicks and 21 handballs 0 goals.

Besides your obvious Centrals bias which is expected - most of that post is rubbish.

I'd say the whole post is rubbish...

[whufc]

I do agree that the best player isn't necessarily the one who gets the most votes in the magarey. If MM votes were the best measuring stick of which players were better then nobody would have anything but midfielders! Sadly when it comes to voting for individuals based on one game and who was the better player, there is no perfect way to judge it. Probably the coaches would be the best ones to decide who hurt them the most and who did their jobs the best, so B&F counts probably offer more in that sense. But how do you incorporate that into a league-wide award for one player? The current system is flawed IMHO, but less flawed than any other system I can think of or have heard of.

As for the Callinan vs Allen debate I think this is a classic case of trying to compare 2 very different footballers. Callinan the brilliant and super skilled and Allen the consistent ball magnet. I think they both suited their teams needs last season better than they would have the other way around so perhaps we might have to consider the influence of team mates in this debate as well. No good being skilled if you don't get the ball, and no good getting the ball if you haven't got the skilled players to get it out to. However, I think the style of Allen is more suited to MM votes. Callinan will flash in and out of a game doing massive damage at times, which seems to get less from the umps than the guy working all day at the bottom of the packs. 40 touches will always get you around the mark, even if those touches aren't that damaging.

Agree withevery thing you said mate IMHO Allen= a poor mans Simon Arnott. Allen rarely kicks the ball forward more than 25 meters and even when he is chipping it around sideways he is not exactly the most skilled and accuarate either.

His impact is so little on a game the Central hierarchy have not once bothered to put a tagger on him in a simliar fashion to ciccolell, let them rack up the possesions they don't create enough with the ball. Allen getting the ball 40 times will hurt you alot less than ladhams getting 15 touches.

I would take Callinan's 20 possesion 4 goal game over Allen with 21 kicks and 21 handballs 0 goals.

Besides your obvious Centrals bias which is expected - most of that post is rubbish.

Well im gonna back Roy Laird here, he cleary isn't of the opinion that Allen has a big impact on games of football proven by his tactics of using a tagger(s) on other players in the midfield such as Ladhams, Motlop, even Bamford when he played. Laird has been happy as larry to let Allen pick up his regular 30 possies at the back of the pack becuase he doesn't use the ball anywhere near as good as these other players.

Roy Laird (4x SANFL Premiership Coach) vs Drebin (don't know the bloke but am gonna assume he hasn't won a SANFL league premeirship as Coach)

For me Roy Laird's opinion is the winner.