Posted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 2:02 pmbennymacca wrote: to you it might not be more important, and thats fair enough, but to the game of football as a whole, and to a vast majority of football fans in this state, it is clearly more important.
Posted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 2:25 pmtigerpie wrote:There is a term for people like you BM.
Arrogant is one, but i think a word that rhymes with banker fits you better!
Posted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 2:29 pmDogwatcher wrote:bennymacca wrote: to you it might not be more important, and thats fair enough, but to the game of football as a whole, and to a vast majority of football fans in this state, it is clearly more important.
See, I understand how it is good for the AFL clubs, this situation, but how is it good for the game of football as a whole? No-one has conclusively explained that to me yet.
Posted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 2:44 pmbennymacca wrote:Dogwatcher wrote:bennymacca wrote: to you it might not be more important, and thats fair enough, but to the game of football as a whole, and to a vast majority of football fans in this state, it is clearly more important.
See, I understand how it is good for the AFL clubs, this situation, but how is it good for the game of football as a whole? No-one has conclusively explained that to me yet.
thats a fair pont actually. i guess i was thinking in terms of being a young footballer, trying to make your way up to the elite level. a clearer pathway and better access to the best coaches all of the time is clearly good for you. in terms of the game as a whole, increased benefit to the crows and power will benefit all levels of football in this state, other than that i might be clutching at straws a bit.
i dont think it is definitely a net negative on football as a whole though, and i think the jury is still out as to the extent the SANFL is going to be affected. will be very interesting to see how the first season goes
Posted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 2:47 pmBooney wrote:Gone and done it now.
Posted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 4:25 pmbennymacca wrote:tigerpie wrote:There is a term for people like you BM.
Arrogant is one, but i think a word that rhymes with banker fits you better!
as the saying goes, smart people discuss ideas, people of average intellect discuss events, dumb people discuss people...
not sure whether you are smart enough to work out which box you go in, but maybe ask your local 5 year old and they could point you in the right direction.
once you resort to personal attacks maybe its time to go sit in the corner and let the big boys talk.
seriously though, im just trying to provide an alternative opinion, and i like discussion, isnt what what a forum is about? i dont disrespect you guys' opinions, i have actually changed my opinion somewhat because of this thread. i think it will have an effect on the SANFL, which i initially didnt really, but im still of the opinion that it is a necessary evil. if you dont think that well thats fine, we are allowed to have differences of opinion, provided it is informed opinion.
Posted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 4:50 pmSimonH wrote:Sorry, how will they have access to "everything at a AFL club" if they're playing for the "Port Adelaide MAGPIES reserve[s]"?kickinit wrote:Port Adelaide MAGPIES reserve will have the best 18 years old's that didn't get drafted to the AFL. Do you really think that a 18 year old that still wants to have a crack at AFL will want to play for norwood over Port. Having access to everything at a AFL club versus only having access to everything at a SANFL club.
Anyway, let's go through it all very slowly now:
1. The 18yo kid who's played Norwood from U/16s and played U/18s last year, is good. Missed getting drafted, and maybe not SANFL league good yet, but certainly reserves good, and could be good enough to push for league selection depending on performances in the 2nds.
2. Norwood obviously don't want to let him go.
3. So the only way he ends up at the Magpies is if he walks, and if Port Adelaide (on the current system) pay a transfer fee.
4. So, will he walk?
5. On the plus side, he gets a lot of talk about playing at an AFL club, having access to an AFL club's facilities, joining an 'academy' and playing for an 'academy team' ('cos that sounds so much more prestigious than joining a reserves squad and playing reserves), and living the dream of having a crack at AFL.
6. On the minus side:
• He will be training and playing with the 3rd tier group at the PAFC, and that fact will effectively be locked in for the whole year; he will be with the 2nd tier group at Norwood, and can instantly be promoted to the top tier if performances warrant it
• He is (barring an improbable run of injuries to the AFL list and the SANFL top-up list) guaranteed not to get a SANFL league game at PAFC. There are about 37 players guaranteed a SANFL league game before him (44 on AFL list + 15 league top-up - 22 AFL players picked each week). That's a massive whack of injuries required before he's even a theoretical chance; whereas Norwood can pick him for his SANFL league debut the minute he earns his spot
• Playing SANFL reserves won't get him on an AFL list. For someone who's already been passed over once, playing well at SANFL reserves level isn't going to impress AFL talent scouts. Every mature-aged draftee from SA I can think of, got the nod by playing stand-out footy at SANFL league level
• He is (if PAFC follow the rules) prohibited from being paid more than $100 per game by the PAFC because he's stuck in the SANFL reserves all year, whereas at Norwood if he earns a league debut, then within the SANFL salary cap Norwood can pay him whatever they like
• He has to leave behind his mates and club he's grown up with, which is a greater-than-usual pull if your home club is successful and the club you're thinking of transferring to, isn't
• The talk of 'if you wanna live the dream of playing AFL, your chances are better if you come to an AFL club' is an obvious crock. If they're interested in persuading him to stay, Norwood can point out to him: "Look at the number of players drafted and rookied from Norwood over the last 5 years, as compared with those wearing a prison bar guernsey."
There may well be the odd decent 18yo who requests to transfer over to Port Adelaide for a range of reasons, including that they buy the hype—in addition to the ex-U/18 castoffs who will make up the bulk of the 'academy'. People do irrational things all of the time, young people even more so.
But good luck with the claim that "the best 18 year olds that didn't get drafted to the AFL" will be lining up en masse to leave behind their SANFL club and train with the 3rd tier group at a bones-of-its-arse AFL club, in order to grasp the prize of not playing SANFL league footy and therefore not attracting the interest of AFL talent scouts.
Posted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 4:55 pmtigerpie wrote:bennymacca wrote:tigerpie wrote:There is a term for people like you BM.
Arrogant is one, but i think a word that rhymes with banker fits you better!
as the saying goes, smart people discuss ideas, people of average intellect discuss events, dumb people discuss people...
not sure whether you are smart enough to work out which box you go in, but maybe ask your local 5 year old and they could point you in the right direction.
once you resort to personal attacks maybe its time to go sit in the corner and let the big boys talk.
seriously though, im just trying to provide an alternative opinion, and i like discussion, isnt what what a forum is about? i dont disrespect you guys' opinions, i have actually changed my opinion somewhat because of this thread. i think it will have an effect on the SANFL, which i initially didnt really, but im still of the opinion that it is a necessary evil. if you dont think that well thats fine, we are allowed to have differences of opinion, provided it is informed opinion.
Some people just need to be told!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 5:03 pmtigerpie wrote:bennymacca wrote:RB wrote:valleys07 wrote:I'm not sure any supporter really thinks its a "right", but more the case of, if the AFL aren't willing to incept a reserves competition, then what are the alternatives.
Of course. But the AFL clubs, in entering the SANFL, are putting themselves before the integrity of the competition. The fact that they would, in the absence of an independent AFL reserves competition, see whatever suits them best as an alternative, regardless of what it will do to the league, is why many SANFL fans feel like this has been forced on them, against their will by the AFL clubs, notwithstanding the weakness of six of the league directors.
so they should, the AFL is more important than the SANFL.
sooner you guys let go, the better
There is a term for people like you BM.
Arrogant is one, but i think a word that rhymes with banker fits you better!
Posted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 5:19 pmbeenreal wrote:SimonH wrote:beenreal wrote:
I'm sure there'll be plenty of backslapping and plaudits from your fellow sycophants Simon, so you just keep dribbling on your keyboard.
Fact is, you're already proven wrong. The PAFC is already coaching U18s and Juniors with the blessing of the AFL.
Posted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 7:10 pmPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 9:03 pmvalleys07 wrote:tigerpie wrote:bennymacca wrote:Some people just need to be told!!!
That they can't have an opinion?
Posted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:20 pmPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:26 pmbeenreal wrote:SimonH wrote:
I'm sure there'll be plenty of backslapping and plaudits from your fellow sycophants Simon, so you just keep dribbling on your keyboard.
Fact is, you're already proven wrong. The PAFC is already coaching U18s and Juniors with the blessing of the AFL.
beenreal wrote:tigerpie wrote:Arrogant is one, but i think a word that rhymes with banker fits you better!
And there you have SA Footy summed up in a nutshell.
Personal abuse/attacks is tolerated (selectively). But questions about that selective tolerance are deleted.
I'll wait for the Fascists to delete this post too.
Posted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:32 pmPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 11:06 pmkickinit wrote:the funny thing about this situation is how everyone is still here. If it was that bad and you had been so screwed over like your all carrying on about, then you wouldn't be here, you would of walked away by now. So either walk away or get over it. It's done and won't be change.
Posted: Sat Jan 18, 2014 1:02 amGood to see that there's someone on SA Footy who's risen above personal attacks.beenreal wrote:I'm sure there'll be plenty of backslapping and plaudits from your fellow sycophants Simon, so you just keep dribbling on your keyboard.
As part of its heritage position as an operator of a U/18 and U/16 team in the SANFL comp, and 'owner' of a recruiting zone for that comp. Nothing to do with 'blessing': Demetriou simply says that these things are about the distribution of talent in the SANFL comp, and the AFL doesn't have a dog in that fight. (See link below.)beenreal wrote:Fact is, you're already proven wrong. The PAFC is already coaching U18s and Juniors with the blessing of the AFL.
Posted: Sat Jan 18, 2014 2:07 amYes, I do think that. Because that's what the history of the draft tells us. It wouldn't be much of a stretch for me to name 20 mature aged players (meaning players who've been overlooked in at least one AFL draft period, 19yo or older) drafted or rookied in the last half-dozen or so years, based on their performance at SANFL league level.kickinit wrote:Do you really think he won't get drafted because he is only playing reserve football? if the scouts know he can't play league unless there is injuries do you really think they wouldn't draft just because were he plays? I let you in on a little secret it's not were you play it's how you play. If a player has increased his size, is quicker and has improved his skills then he will have a better chance of getting drafted.
kickinit wrote:You do realise playing in that academy side, he will have access to everything the AFL players have. coaches, trainers, facilities and not to mention training with AFL players.
No, that's an assertion. A 'fact' is the quality of the SANFL reserves footballers that you will actually play once the zones are taken from you and the junior teams' tap is turned off. I doubt that it will bring the kids flocking. As for the suggestion that it's all going to be handball drills with Chad Wingard, and Burgo monitoring your progress against his personally-devised fitness plan for you, it's a shame that your CEO doesn't seem to agree:kickinit wrote:Working with Darren Burgess and his team would do wonders for a 18 year old, which they won't be able to do at any other sanfl club. The fact is the training and advice he will receive at port is going to be far greater then what any sanfl club can offer him.
We will have a clear delineation between our Magpies operation and the AFL program...
Posted: Sat Jan 18, 2014 8:04 amPosted: Sat Jan 18, 2014 9:04 amPseudo wrote:kickinit wrote:the funny thing about this situation is how everyone is still here. If it was that bad and you had been so screwed over like your all carrying on about, then you wouldn't be here, you would of walked away by now. So either walk away or get over it. It's done and won't be change.
Time to invoke Godwin's Law...
By the early 1940s, many denizens of Western Europe had walked away from the situation - i.e. fled before the Panzer divisions rolled over the bridge.
Some who stayed accepted the situation and made the best of it. Consider Marshal Pétain and the collaborationist Vichy Republic.
Some stayed but resisted the occupation.
Likewise many will stay here - but don't expect them to express anything but vitriol for the occupation, the occupiers, and the collaborators.
Vive le SANFL! Vive la Résistance!