a close look at the dogs of 2008.

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a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby gillies8 » Wed Nov 19, 2008 9:04 pm

When you look at Centrals play it's easy to think they are made up of guys who must be on huge money because they've all been recruited to the club but closer inspection of the 2008 Grand Final side doesnt support this.
Yes there is a couple that we have recruited and they would have got good money

Callinan and OSullivan in recent seasons.

We have a group who are on AFL lists and thus do not come under the salary cap

Ryan Williams, John Giles, Mathew Westoff, James Moss.

We then have the Gowan boys who wouldnt have been on top dollar in there 1st season or 2 (remember South had them and let them go) but I know for a fact they are not the top paid blokes at the club and are happy getting what they get as they have a good business and are happy for us to remain strong rather than fill their pockets.

Then you have a group of local lads who's heart's come before their pockets-

McCabe, Cochrane, Dutske, Thomas, Mackenzie, Schell, Sibenaler, Aufderheide, Ohara, Ware and Slade

That then leaves Trent Goodram and Andrew Hayes who both came over after Peter Jonas sold the club to them. Both came with hope of a senior game and the club did not chase either of them, the club took them after Jonas recomended them.

One thing Centrals does well is not to recruit guys straight out of the AFL who demand big dollars (Something the Port Magpies have been doing for 2 or 3 seasons). The guys we get out of the AFL are past Central players such as Schell, McCabe and probably Eddie Sansbury this season. The past players come with a much reduced price tag because they want to be here.

People can say what they want but the men in charge at Elizabeth recruit well, produce good talent from our zones but most of all provide a club that players want to be involved with and most importantly want to stay at.
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby wycbloods » Wed Nov 19, 2008 9:26 pm

gillies8 wrote:When you look at Centrals play it's easy to think they are made up of guys who must be on huge money because they've all been recruited to the club but closer inspection of the 2008 Grand Final side doesnt support this.
Yes there is a couple that we have recruited and they would have got good money

Callinan and OSullivan in recent seasons.

We have a group who are on AFL lists and thus do not come under the salary cap

Ryan Williams, John Giles, Mathew Westoff, James Moss.

We then have the Gowan boys who wouldnt have been on top dollar in there 1st season or 2 (remember South had them and let them go) but I know for a fact they are not the top paid blokes at the club and are happy getting what they get as they have a good business and are happy for us to remain strong rather than fill their pockets.

Then you have a group of local lads who's heart's come before their pockets-

McCabe, Cochrane, Dutske, Thomas, Mackenzie, Schell, Sibenaler, Aufderheide, Ohara, Ware and Slade

That then leaves Trent Goodram and Andrew Hayes who both came over after Peter Jonas sold the club to them. Both came with hope of a senior game and the club did not chase either of them, the club took them after Jonas recomended them.

One thing Centrals does well is not to recruit guys straight out of the AFL who demand big dollars (Something the Port Magpies have been doing for 2 or 3 seasons). The guys we get out of the AFL are past Central players such as Schell, McCabe and probably Eddie Sansbury this season. The past players come with a much reduced price tag because they want to be here.

People can say what they want but the men in charge at Elizabeth recruit well, produce good talent from our zones but most of all provide a club that players want to be involved with and most importantly want to stay at.


Good summary G8. I believe(am probably wrong) the match payments for the 21 that take to the park each week needs to come under the salary cap but they wouldn't be getting the 'retainer' like payment that some of the sanfl based players receive.
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Agree with AF on this one!
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby JK » Wed Nov 19, 2008 9:47 pm

Good post G8 ... I've always believed the Dogs stength lay in it's culture (the one it methodically worked hard to develop instead of settling for average) TBH and I believe it's relevant to it's personnel including those it imports, ie, they developed a stable foundation and then retained that, topping up with quality not quantity.

I've had this discussion among fellow Norwood supporters and our record of providing VFL/AFL footballers is pretty damn good, but we've developed very few Norwood/SANFL only players in the last 10 years and that needs to change, it's a huge strength of the Dogs IMHO (that and getting quality recruits to stay for several years).
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby am Bays » Wed Nov 19, 2008 10:00 pm

IMO the secret of Centrals is that the whole is greater than the sum of the parts.

I'm still gutted over what transpired seven weeks ago but what I reconcile with is that I got to witness two weeks of peerless team footy where when players needed to make the sacrifice they did in order to be the premier team.

From a footballing purist's pint of view it was a pleasure to be there to see it.
Let that be a lesson to you Port, no one beats the Bays five times in a row in a GF and gets away with it!!!
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby JK » Wed Nov 19, 2008 10:14 pm

1980 Tassie Medalist wrote:IMO the secret of Centrals is that the whole is greater than the sum of the parts.

I'm still gutted over what transpired seven weeks ago but what I reconcile with is that I got to witness two weeks of peerless team footy where when players needed to make the sacrifice they did in order to be the premier team.

From a footballing purist's pint of view it was a pleasure to be there to see it.


Agree with all of that, but IMHO their true strength is that they always seem to feel as though they are in control of a game, even when behind (they never allow it to get out of reach).

That belief is unwaivering, and that's what I want for my team.
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby Big Phil » Wed Nov 19, 2008 10:41 pm

Another interesting fact that might surprise a few people is that out of the 56 individual players that have won a premiership for Centrals only 3 players were recruited to the club having previously played AFL football. They were Simon Arnott (Geelong & Sydney) Daniel Stevens (Kangaroos) and James Gowans (St. Kilda) but more importantly around 35 of them are local products from the Northern Suburbs and Barossa Valley area that have come up through the grades at the club.

There is also a number of players who have won a flag(s) with the Dogs after returning to club once their AFL stints are over. Like most clubs, these players appreciate their SANFL grass roots and generally return to the club to give something back. Guys like Daniel Healy (St. Kilda), Daniel Schell (Fremantle & Adelaide), Paul Thomas (Essendon) Stuart Cochrane (Kangaroos & Port Power), Paul Geister (Kangaroos & Port Power), Adam Switala (Essendon), Luke McCabe (Hawthorn) and Martin McKinnon (Adelaide & Geelong) all came back to the Dogs once their shot at the big league was over.

Yes, like most clubs, Centrals have recruited players from interstate, mainly Tasmania and Victoria, and they have gone on to be members of a premiership side. These players are either capable enough that step straight into the starting 21 or are players that serve apprenticeships in the reserves for a couple of years before their opportunity higher up comes along. Club CEO Kris Grant and the coaches from years gone by this decade certainly have had a good eye for quality interstate footballers. Guys like Heath Hopwood, Paul Scoullar, Luke Cowan, Chad O'Sullivan, and Kynan Ford all paid their dues in the twos and went on to be consistent league players and Premiership winners.

The other thing which I think the Doggies have been good at (and perhaps lucky in some instances) is their selections at the SANFL Mini Draft. History shows that we generally get the last couple of picks due to selection process in reverse order of the premiership ladder from the previous season. Other clubs have had the opportunity to pick certain players ahead of us but have gone with other options. Players like Brent Guerra, Ryan Williams, Michael Stevens and Jonathon Griffin have all won flags in the red, white and blue because they have all fitted in to the club and it's culture extremely well, making them feel comfortable enough to get the best out of themselves.

Keeping interstate recruits for long periods of time something the clubs seems to very well also. They don't get the 'one year flash in the pan' recruit that heads off after 12 months chasing more money or better opportunities. The club provides an atmosphere that is too good to leave, for example the Gowans twins are now coming up to their 10th year in the SANFL which is just great for the club and the competition. Centrals made it publicly aware that they decided the only way to become successful was to follow the blueprint of the Port Magpies. This amazing club is now setting the new benchmark and I'm sure that other clubs out there are looking to replicate the success of the Dogs.
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby sjt » Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:05 am

I concur Big Phil. Quite an amazing stat only 3 players had played AFL (and I think James was only about 4 games). It certainly dispels a lot of misconceptions. Also interesting is only three players are left form the 2000 premiership side. I think 13 different players played in the 2008 Gf versus 2005 (quite a bit of re-building). Finally I think there was only about 7 "recruits", non home grown talent in the 2008 side.
Having said that the current decades strategy has worked, I'd still hope they could pick up at least a couple of quality players for next year.
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby Big Phil » Thu Nov 20, 2008 10:05 am

Yeah, it does make it a bit more satisfying when you can have success with local products doesn't it...
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby Dogwatcher » Thu Nov 20, 2008 10:16 am

I would be interested to see AH's take on this.
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby Big Phil » Thu Nov 20, 2008 10:20 am

Dogwatcher wrote:I would be interested to see AH's take on this.


He's not the one who said that the Jack Oatey Medalist takes a fortnight to run out out of sight and that the SANFL season just gone was boring and inevitable was he ? :?

Pretty embarrasing ??? Wasn't Jason "Buckets" Mackenzie judged the player of the finals series ?? :D



Oh, hang on a sec, that's your signature :lol:

I like your work DW, well done :wink:
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby gillies8 » Thu Nov 20, 2008 6:23 pm

Big Phil wrote:Another interesting fact that might surprise a few people is that out of the 56 individual players that have won a premiership for Centrals only 3 players were recruited to the club having previously played AFL football. They were Simon Arnott (Geelong & Sydney) Daniel Stevens (Kangaroos) and James Gowans (St. Kilda) but more importantly around 35 of them are local products from the Northern Suburbs and Barossa Valley area that have come up through the grades at the club.

There is also a number of players who have won a flag(s) with the Dogs after returning to club once their AFL stints are over. Like most clubs, these players appreciate their SANFL grass roots and generally return to the club to give something back. Guys like Daniel Healy (St. Kilda), Daniel Schell (Fremantle & Adelaide), Paul Thomas (Essendon) Stuart Cochrane (Kangaroos & Port Power), Paul Geister (Kangaroos & Port Power), Adam Switala (Essendon), Luke McCabe (Hawthorn) and Martin McKinnon (Adelaide & Geelong) all came back to the Dogs once their shot at the big league was over.

Yes, like most clubs, Centrals have recruited players from interstate, mainly Tasmania and Victoria, and they have gone on to be members of a premiership side. These players are either capable enough that step straight into the starting 21 or are players that serve apprenticeships in the reserves for a couple of years before their opportunity higher up comes along. Club CEO Kris Grant and the coaches from years gone by this decade certainly have had a good eye for quality interstate footballers. Guys like Heath Hopwood, Paul Scoullar, Luke Cowan, Chad O'Sullivan, and Kynan Ford all paid their dues in the twos and went on to be consistent league players and Premiership winners.

The other thing which I think the Doggies have been good at (and perhaps lucky in some instances) is their selections at the SANFL Mini Draft. History shows that we generally get the last couple of picks due to selection process in reverse order of the premiership ladder from the previous season. Other clubs have had the opportunity to pick certain players ahead of us but have gone with other options. Players like Brent Guerra, Ryan Williams, Michael Stevens and Jonathon Griffin have all won flags in the red, white and blue because they have all fitted in to the club and it's culture extremely well, making them feel comfortable enough to get the best out of themselves.

Keeping interstate recruits for long periods of time something the clubs seems to very well also. They don't get the 'one year flash in the pan' recruit that heads off after 12 months chasing more money or better opportunities. The club provides an atmosphere that is too good to leave, for example the Gowans twins are now coming up to their 10th year in the SANFL which is just great for the club and the competition. Centrals made it publicly aware that they decided the only way to become successful was to follow the blueprint of the Port Magpies. This amazing club is now setting the new benchmark and I'm sure that other clubs out there are looking to replicate the success of the Dogs.


Cant agree that Kynan Ford was a good recruit, NIGHTMARE!
I personally believe the mini draft is a lottery for us simply because we generally get the left overs, we have just got lucky.
What we are good at is giving them as professional enviroment to come back to and help them play well.
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby Big Phil » Thu Nov 20, 2008 6:33 pm

gillies8 wrote:
Big Phil wrote:Another interesting fact that might surprise a few people is that out of the 56 individual players that have won a premiership for Centrals only 3 players were recruited to the club having previously played AFL football. They were Simon Arnott (Geelong & Sydney) Daniel Stevens (Kangaroos) and James Gowans (St. Kilda) but more importantly around 35 of them are local products from the Northern Suburbs and Barossa Valley area that have come up through the grades at the club.

There is also a number of players who have won a flag(s) with the Dogs after returning to club once their AFL stints are over. Like most clubs, these players appreciate their SANFL grass roots and generally return to the club to give something back. Guys like Daniel Healy (St. Kilda), Daniel Schell (Fremantle & Adelaide), Paul Thomas (Essendon) Stuart Cochrane (Kangaroos & Port Power), Paul Geister (Kangaroos & Port Power), Adam Switala (Essendon), Luke McCabe (Hawthorn) and Martin McKinnon (Adelaide & Geelong) all came back to the Dogs once their shot at the big league was over.

Yes, like most clubs, Centrals have recruited players from interstate, mainly Tasmania and Victoria, and they have gone on to be members of a premiership side. These players are either capable enough that step straight into the starting 21 or are players that serve apprenticeships in the reserves for a couple of years before their opportunity higher up comes along. Club CEO Kris Grant and the coaches from years gone by this decade certainly have had a good eye for quality interstate footballers. Guys like Heath Hopwood, Paul Scoullar, Luke Cowan, Chad O'Sullivan, and Kynan Ford all paid their dues in the twos and went on to be consistent league players and Premiership winners.

The other thing which I think the Doggies have been good at (and perhaps lucky in some instances) is their selections at the SANFL Mini Draft. History shows that we generally get the last couple of picks due to selection process in reverse order of the premiership ladder from the previous season. Other clubs have had the opportunity to pick certain players ahead of us but have gone with other options. Players like Brent Guerra, Ryan Williams, Michael Stevens and Jonathon Griffin have all won flags in the red, white and blue because they have all fitted in to the club and it's culture extremely well, making them feel comfortable enough to get the best out of themselves.

Keeping interstate recruits for long periods of time something the clubs seems to very well also. They don't get the 'one year flash in the pan' recruit that heads off after 12 months chasing more money or better opportunities. The club provides an atmosphere that is too good to leave, for example the Gowans twins are now coming up to their 10th year in the SANFL which is just great for the club and the competition. Centrals made it publicly aware that they decided the only way to become successful was to follow the blueprint of the Port Magpies. This amazing club is now setting the new benchmark and I'm sure that other clubs out there are looking to replicate the success of the Dogs.


Cant agree that Kynan Ford was a good recruit, NIGHTMARE!
I personally believe the mini draft is a lottery for us simply because we generally get the left overs, we have just got lucky.
What we are good at is giving them as professional enviroment to come back to and help them play well.


So someone who won 2 Premierships playing the hardest position on the ground was a nightmare :shock:

Yes, he wasn't the best recruit we have ever had but he was an honest perfrormer who again, won 2 flags with us :D
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby Harry the Horse » Thu Nov 20, 2008 7:32 pm

This is all a wonderful fairytale.
And yes, the Gowans may not be the top paid players at the club ... but there are ways of "helping out" players above and beyond the number on their pay cheques.
Say what you like, I don't care but it goes on .. and not just at Central.
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby Big Phil » Thu Nov 20, 2008 7:54 pm

Harry the Horse wrote:This is all a wonderful fairytale.
And yes, the Gowans may not be the top paid players at the club ... but there are ways of "helping out" players above and beyond the number on their pay cheques.
Say what you like, I don't care but it goes on .. and not just at Central.



Yes, it goes on at all clubs, we can't deny it because there is no way of proving otherwise. I'm sure the Bays have their way, the same as the Dogs do, and North, Port, West etc.
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby gillies8 » Sat Nov 22, 2008 10:23 pm

Big Phil wrote:
gillies8 wrote:
Big Phil wrote:Another interesting fact that might surprise a few people is that out of the 56 individual players that have won a premiership for Centrals only 3 players were recruited to the club having previously played AFL football. They were Simon Arnott (Geelong & Sydney) Daniel Stevens (Kangaroos) and James Gowans (St. Kilda) but more importantly around 35 of them are local products from the Northern Suburbs and Barossa Valley area that have come up through the grades at the club.

There is also a number of players who have won a flag(s) with the Dogs after returning to club once their AFL stints are over. Like most clubs, these players appreciate their SANFL grass roots and generally return to the club to give something back. Guys like Daniel Healy (St. Kilda), Daniel Schell (Fremantle & Adelaide), Paul Thomas (Essendon) Stuart Cochrane (Kangaroos & Port Power), Paul Geister (Kangaroos & Port Power), Adam Switala (Essendon), Luke McCabe (Hawthorn) and Martin McKinnon (Adelaide & Geelong) all came back to the Dogs once their shot at the big league was over.

Yes, like most clubs, Centrals have recruited players from interstate, mainly Tasmania and Victoria, and they have gone on to be members of a premiership side. These players are either capable enough that step straight into the starting 21 or are players that serve apprenticeships in the reserves for a couple of years before their opportunity higher up comes along. Club CEO Kris Grant and the coaches from years gone by this decade certainly have had a good eye for quality interstate footballers. Guys like Heath Hopwood, Paul Scoullar, Luke Cowan, Chad O'Sullivan, and Kynan Ford all paid their dues in the twos and went on to be consistent league players and Premiership winners.

The other thing which I think the Doggies have been good at (and perhaps lucky in some instances) is their selections at the SANFL Mini Draft. History shows that we generally get the last couple of picks due to selection process in reverse order of the premiership ladder from the previous season. Other clubs have had the opportunity to pick certain players ahead of us but have gone with other options. Players like Brent Guerra, Ryan Williams, Michael Stevens and Jonathon Griffin have all won flags in the red, white and blue because they have all fitted in to the club and it's culture extremely well, making them feel comfortable enough to get the best out of themselves.

Keeping interstate recruits for long periods of time something the clubs seems to very well also. They don't get the 'one year flash in the pan' recruit that heads off after 12 months chasing more money or better opportunities. The club provides an atmosphere that is too good to leave, for example the Gowans twins are now coming up to their 10th year in the SANFL which is just great for the club and the competition. Centrals made it publicly aware that they decided the only way to become successful was to follow the blueprint of the Port Magpies. This amazing club is now setting the new benchmark and I'm sure that other clubs out there are looking to replicate the success of the Dogs.


Cant agree that Kynan Ford was a good recruit, NIGHTMARE!
I personally believe the mini draft is a lottery for us simply because we generally get the left overs, we have just got lucky.
What we are good at is giving them as professional enviroment to come back to and help them play well.


So someone who won 2 Premierships playing the hardest position on the ground was a nightmare :shock:

Yes, he wasn't the best recruit we have ever had but he was an honest perfrormer who again, won 2 flags with us :D


You can :shock: all you like but sit down and watch the 1st GF again and laugh at his 2 dropped marks within a minute. 15 metre kicks from Rick McGowan that incredibly he grasses twice. Still remember him in the club on the Monday night rewinding the tape to watch himself kick a goal and Scotty Lee giving him stick.

He was at the right place at the right time. He was a dead set battler who had little impact in either of the 1st 2 premierships. Not worthy of being mentioned along side Hopwood, Osullivan, Scoullar and Cowan.
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby NO-MERCY » Sat Nov 22, 2008 10:32 pm

Very harsh gillie, what have you done?
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby Big Phil » Sun Nov 23, 2008 12:10 pm

I actually watched the 2000 GF the other weekend gillies and while yes, Kynan didn't have a great game, don't you remember it pi$$ed down all day so the ball was heavy, greasy and wet so hardly anyone would have been taking marks in the hands.

While he never set the world on fire, I agree, he was an honest performer and once again, won 2 premiership medals with the club. He must have been half decent for Peter Jonas and Al Clarkson to select him in the side.
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby The Gimp » Tue Nov 25, 2008 12:18 pm

I have heard Aufderheide has signed with Lobethal to return back there and play. Will he still play at Centrals and only return to Lobethal when not required or has he finished at Centrals?

Can anyone confirm?
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Re: a close look at the dogs of 2008.

Postby Big Phil » Tue Nov 25, 2008 1:33 pm

The Gimp wrote:I have heard Aufderheide has signed with Lobethal to return back there and play. Will he still play at Centrals and only return to Lobethal when not required or has he finished at Centrals?

Can anyone confirm?


If Jezza has signed with Lobethal he would have definately retired from Centrals and would play full time with the Tigers (?). There has been a few whispers that he was going to retire from SANFL and head back to his local club so i wouldn't be suprised if it is actually true.

He was close to pulling the pin from Centrals the season just gone because he was struggling with injury and form but in the end, managed to sneak back into Central league team and pinch another Premiership. Would be a good way to go out from the SANFL and would be a good pick up for Lobethal.

Maybe ask the question over on the Country Footy thread, I'm sure someone there can confirm or deny this.
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