Jack Oatey Medallists

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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby DOC » Sat May 09, 2020 5:50 pm

I was just about to reply that I did not see the game until I realised the pun was intended.
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby robranisgod » Wed May 13, 2020 8:26 pm

And so to 1968. For most of the year, it was a two horse race, with Sturt only losing two games for the year, both to Port Adelaide and in the game between the two clubs that Sturt won, in reality the game should have been a draw. The ball was in the Sturt forward line as the siren rang. Former West Torrens player, Don Russell, was the umpire and he signalled the end of the game. A Sturt player then picked up the ball and kicked the ball between the goal and point post. The goal umpire ran out to Umpire Russell and asked was that all clear. Apparently Russell misinterpreted the question said yes, thinking that he meant, was the game over. The goal umpire then went back and signalled a point, Sturt's wining margin.
In Port's win against Sturt on the traditional Anzac Day game, young Port Riverland recruit Russell Ebert kicked 6 goals in a sign of things to come.
Amazingly five rounds after the first fiasco, during the game between Sturt and Glenelg, Glenelg ruckman, Doug Long seemingly scored a goal, which was disallowed because the goal umpire was unsighted saying that he had been hit by a paper bag filled with sand, or something similar. Sturt won that game also by a point.
The closest rival to Sturt and Port was North, who were always playing catch up. They lost their first 3 games for the year before winning 14 out of their last 17 games. The problem was that of their 6 losses, 3 were to Sturt by 31, 34 and 37 points.
Glenelg had looked a likely finalist for most of the year, but fell away badly in the last few minor round games and when West beat them by a goal at Glenelg in the second last round. West took their spot in the four.
Sadly for its vast army of supporters, Norwood finished wooden spooners, the first time since 1919.
North won the first semi final by 34 points, but it was only after a couple of scares. New Magarey Medallist Barrie Robran turned an ankle and West looked to have momentum in the last quarter, when a long shot from David Jonas just missed. North went down, scored a behind and then a terrible kick out by Trevor Hughes when trying to pass to captain Murray Weideman saw North intercept and goal and stretch the lead to 16 points as time on started. North then scored 3 goals in time on for a seemingly comfortable victory.
Sturt fronted a supremely confident Port who believed that Sturt hadn't beaten them in 3 starts. Port reckoned without Keith Chessell though. Chessell scored 8 goals out of Sturt's 15 goals 15 to enable Sturt to prevail by 13 points. Sturt had led all day, but Port threatened in the last quarter when, Eric Freeman, who had just arrived back in Adelaide days earlier after an Ashes tour of England, came onto the ground and threatened to take the game away from Sturt,
North led Port by 19 points at half time and threatened to cause an upset, but Freeman once more came on to the ground, this time in the third quarter to help change the game. North also lost young stars Barrie Robran and Dennis Sachse with ankle injuries and Port stormed home to win by 19 points.
The Grand Final was a game that after quarter time, Sturt were never going to lose. Port led by 1 point at quarter time despite Sturt rover, Peter Endersbee, kicking two seemingly miraculous check side goals from the scoreboard pocket. By half time an inaccurate Sturt had led by 13 points and then 31 points at three quarter time before finally winning by 27 points.
In a very even Sturt performance, Peter Argent has chosen Paul Bagshaw as best on the ground. Baggy up to that stage had been inconsistent in finals and big games. He had played fantastically in the 1965 Preliminary Final but poorly in the 1965 Grand Final and he was poor again in the 1966 Grand Final until he absolutely turned it on in the last quarter of that game. He only had a fair 1967 Grand Final and this together with some poor interstate games had people querying whether he could play in big games. 1968 proved them wrong when his class shone out, in as I said what was a very even team effort. As an aside, the Channel 9 commentary team awarded two best player watches, one to Bagshaw and the other to Brenton Miels, but generally Baggy with that extra class just shaded Miels in most people's opinion.
This awarding of a watch for best player became a Channel 9 tradition and I am sure many posters would remember players vying for the Seiko.
Last edited by robranisgod on Thu May 14, 2020 11:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby mal » Thu May 14, 2020 12:17 am

Did PA attempt a more defensive game plan in 1968 in the minor round ?
1965 17-3....1756...1357
1966 14-6...1813....1267
1967 14-6...1769....1324
1968 15-5...1401....1013

PA finished the minor round in 2nd spot with 1401 points for
NW finished wooden spooners with 1515 points for
Only CD 1410[8th] and WDV 1202[9th] finished with less points for

PA must have defended stoutly conceding only 1013 points at an average of 50.65 per match
The highest score in the minor round against them was WA scoring a' whopping' 13-10[88]

Sturt scored 15-15 against PA in the second semi, which ends up being the highest score against PA for the season

1968 GRAND FINAL
ST 3-3...5-11...10.-13...12-18
PA 3-4...4-4.......6-6.........9-9

The memory I have of this GF was of Peter Endersbee
He used the uncommon kick for the times the check side kick
He scored 2 check side goals at the scoreboard end, and good on him for taking a punt


The irony of this match is the teenage Peter Endersbee scored 4-3 a total of 27 points
ST defeated PA by exactly 27 points, you could say Peter was the difference between the 2 sides ....

Paul Mr Magic Bagshaw deserved to be acknowledged as B.O.G in this match
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby FOURTH ESTATE » Thu May 14, 2020 11:35 am

1968 was one of the wettest seasons on record. Scoring all over the league was down compared to previous seasons.
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Let that be a lesson to you Sturt. You don't beat Glenelg 3 times in a row in Grand Finals and get away with it.
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby robranisgod » Thu May 14, 2020 12:13 pm

mal wrote:Did PA attempt a more defensive game plan in 1968 in the minor round ?
1965 17-3....1756...1357
1966 14-6...1813....1267
1967 14-6...1769....1324
1968 15-5...1401....1013

PA finished the minor round in 2nd spot with 1401 points for
NW finished wooden spooners with 1515 points for
Only CD 1410[8th] and WDV 1202[9th] finished with less points for

PA must have defended stoutly conceding only 1013 points at an average of 50.65 per match
The highest score in the minor round against them was WA scoring a' whopping' 13-10[88]

Sturt scored 15-15 against PA in the second semi, which ends up being the highest score against PA for the season

1968 GRAND FINAL
ST 3-3...5-11...10.-13...12-18
PA 3-4...4-4.......6-6.........9-9


Interesting point you make about Port's low scoring. I think that one of the main reasons was that they were without their key forward, Eric Freeman for all of the minor round. I mentioned Russell Ebert's game against Sturt on Anzac Day, but as an 18 year old he couldn't be expected to replace Freeman for a full season and was in fact dropped to the reserves bench for two games in the middle of winter.
Freeman led Port's goalkicking with 74 goals in 1967, Ebert led Port's goalkicking with 44 goals in 1968, a difference of 180 points.I can't think of Port having any other damaging forward at that stage. Premiership Reggie Beaufoy hurt his knee and retired during 1968.
Further to Fourth Estate's point 1967 was South Australia's driest year ever but 1968 certainly had a number of wet days which would have impacted scoring, and I suggest that would have made the approximately other 180 points difference between 1967 and 1968.
To remain competitive, Port would therefore have had to concentrated on defence. Something they were traditionally very good at anyway, In retrospect given their lack of forwards in 1968 it is a credit to Foster Williams that he got Port to the Grand Final. John Cahill was at his peak at that stage and was named to captain the state, Dennis Errey had moved from the wing to half back and immediately had become an interstate player so that move would have also strengthened an already strong defence.
I would be interested in any other theories.
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby FOURTH ESTATE » Thu May 14, 2020 2:56 pm

I can clearly remember the storms of 68 as if it were yesterday

I can clearly remember one massive storm. Mum & Dad were sitting in the passage way of our house in Pooraka with me and my sister (Youngest sister not born yet) and holding onto my teddy bear for dear life as the massive hail storm that was predicted hit and it was so loud. Thunder & lightning everywhere and this was during the day It was mid afternoon and the sky was so Black. I asked my parents why were we in the passage and was told this was the safest place to be and that the coming storm was going to be like a cyclone. After the storm stopped our whole front & back yard was white with hail stones.

Things that stand out that you remember as a kid

Working for a newspaper has its advantages. I get to look at the newspaper archives for my football research in my free time and when looking at the football pictures for 1968 all most all of the photos are of wet & muddy conditions each round.

This would go a long way to explain the low scores for all teams in 1968
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Let that be a lesson to you Sturt. You don't beat Glenelg 3 times in a row in Grand Finals and get away with it.
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby mal » Thu May 14, 2020 5:16 pm

1968
For most of that season I was o/seas , basking in the mediterranean sunshine, whilst some of youse had to go through the Adelaide wet winter !
Thanks for that post FE it is a conclusive reason why PA scored lowly that season
I checked on some football stats, but didnt have time to check the rainfalls on saturdays !

TOTAL POINTS SCORED IN MINOR ROUNDS ALL TEAMS
1965-17044
1966 -16643
1967-17201
1968-15106

EACH TEAM INDIVIDUAL TOTAL POINTS SCORED IN MINOR ROUND 1965-1968 INCLUSIVE
The last year is 1968 where the totals were collectively lower

CD-1623-1325-1199-1410
GL-1721-1340-1835-1464
NA-1808-1595-2048-1574
NW-1932-1629-1830-1515
PA-1756-1813-1769-1411
SA-1829-1966-1729-1538
ST-1953-2247-2122-2072
WA-1516-1628-1780-1484
WD-1463-1393-1450-1202
WT-1443-1707-1439-1436

So there it is in 'black and white' why PA only scored 1411 points, and well below its previous 3 seasons
It is still a tad perplexing why PA had the 8th best for, thats unusual for a team finishing 2nd in the minor round

So in summary Im going to agree with FE and RIG
The weather yes absolutely
PA being without excellent forwards Eric Fritz Freeman and Red Beaufoy did rob them of scoring potency
Great reasoning and rationality by both posters

I wont raise the issue with CD scoring more in 68 that 67 though
I would say the 1199 CD scored in 1967 was just a lack of potency compared to the other teams , and 1968 rain or shine they simply improved

But i do have an enquiry for the gurus
Did ST play exceedingly well on wet tracks in 1968 ?
I raise the question as they only scored 50 points less than 1967
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby heater31 » Thu May 14, 2020 5:50 pm

The improved scoring of Central could be that they played home games at a well draining Elizabeth Oval if '68 was wet would imagine that all ovals would have been a mess each week. Even today Elizabeth seems to take on water better than every other oval in the competition
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby FOURTH ESTATE » Thu May 14, 2020 6:55 pm

Sturt somehow had a knack of winning in the wet. They won some close games in 68 and their skills were top notch. One only has to look at the video of the 1970 Grand Final and their skills in the wet and some of their players of that era were coming to an end of their careers so they were at their height of skill in 68. That was the difference between Port & Sturt, the game was changing and Sturt adapted quicker. John Cahill in an interview for Port's 150th said he used 3 traits when coaching

Fos Williams preparedness
Neil Kerley's Inspiration
Jack Oateys skillfulness.

John Cahill realized what was missing at Port and changed their game style to more attacking and skillful than Fos Williams did. Always felt that Port Adelaide in the late 60's early 70's tried to play 1950's football and it slowly caught up with them as other clubs changed their game style or tried to be like Sturt
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Let that be a lesson to you Sturt. You don't beat Glenelg 3 times in a row in Grand Finals and get away with it.
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby robranisgod » Mon May 18, 2020 10:44 pm

1969 was a most unusual year. Glenelg won their first 11 matches before losing to Torrens in Round 12. Torrens hen proceeded to win their last 10 Minor Round Matches, yet neither of these teams won the flag. Additionally Port missed the finals for the first time in 20 years. They once again had huge problems in attack scoring only 6 points more than they had in 1968 but this time conceding over 400 points more than in 1968. They only won 9 of their 20 matches and finished with a percentage of below 50%.
Glenelg had a slump in form in mid season but came into the finals with a 17-3 win loss record and a percentage of over 63%. Many people expected Sturt to fall away with the departure of Doc Clarkson to England, the retirement of John Halbert, the loss of John Murphy to South Melbourne and the temporary loss of Brenton Miels to Richmond as a result of his National Service. They still finished the Minor Round Second with a 15-5 record, though. It is fair to say that West Adelaide flew under the radar for much of the year but they also finished with a 15-5 record but a much inferior percentage to Sturt.
For most of the year North looked likely finalists but they lost their place in the finals to Torrens who had a 4-6 win loss record at the half way mark of the season but never lost another game for the entire minor round.
Coming to the finals many pundits expected a Glenelg versus Torrens Grand Final and certainly Torrens were red hot favourites to defeat West in the First Semi Final. Torrens led comfortably during the second quarter but West gradually fought back despite inaccurate goalkicking and the match ended in a draw. In the replay Torrens again led early but by 3/4 time West had a 3 goal lead which they maintained until the end of the game.
Glenelg started favourite in the Second Semi. Ken Eustice had been absolutely starring for them and Fred Phillis had become the first ever Full Forward to win the Magarey Medal, but Sturt lifted a gear and were untroubled to win the Second Semi by 38 points.
Glenelg then made light work of West defeating them by 63 points in the Preliminary Final. To most people's surprise West had led at half time by 2 points but Glenelg thrashed them in the Second Half.
Thus there were still those who fancied Glenelg in the Grand Final, especially with the introduction to the team of Royce Hart. But Sturt were never headed in the Grand Final and gave a brilliant display of Football played in perfect football conditions. They led by 24 points at quarter time, 32 points at half time, 47 points at 3/4 time before running out 65 point winners. Peter Argent's best player on the ground was Malcolm Greenslade, who played full forward and equalled the record for the number of goals scored by an individual in an SANFL Grand Final with 9 goals. Greenslade was a fast leading full forward who kicked accurate screw punts (as they were then known) for goal. He was a local product, having come from Unley High School and he had been 19th man in the 1967 Grand Final. It was somewhat surprising that he didn't make the team in 1968 but he made amends with a brilliant display of leading and goal kicking in the Grand Final. John Tilbrook had been brilliant also on a half forward flank and Paul Bagshaw, Daryl Hicks and Brenton Adcock played to their usual very high standard.
Thus Sturt had won their fourth Grand Final in a row despite a number of changes in personnel. They had been able to add new stars to the premiership side in Ottens, Wild, Nunan and Burgan together with journeyman, Clive Brooks to maintain their invincibility in finals.
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby mal » Mon May 18, 2020 11:53 pm

The drawn first semi final 1969
WA 2-3...4-9...7-14...10-16
WT 5-2 ...8-3...10-6...11-10

The replay
WA 3-2...5-3...10-7...13-11
WT 5-2...6-4...7-7.....10-8

The 1st qtrs in both finals had the almost identical scores

RD10 the following year 1970
WA 5-6...5-7...7-9...10-11
WT 0-2...3-6...10-8.13-10

In this game notice the similarity in the 3/4 and full time scores to the replayed final
Only this time WT won the match

In the 2 WA V WT finals the crowd attendances were interesting
1st final 28,349
2nd final 26315
I would have thought more people would roll up for the replay 13/9/1969
It ends up being one of the most significant days in Australian sporting history
On the day of this final St Kilda junior footballer Shane Keith Warne was born
The biggest selling single of the year was The Real Thing sung by Russell Morris
Not the Russell Morris who played for St Kilda
The producer of The Real Thing is a great supporter of St Kilda , Molly Meldrum

GL V ST matches of 1969

RD3
GL 14-21
ST 6-10

RD 13
ST 10-5
GL 6-12

SECOND SEMI
GL 11-20
ST 18-16

GRAND FINAL
ST 24-15
GL 13-16

Peter Argents JO nominee MAL Greenslade kicked 9-4 almost the difference between the 2 teams
Anyone who kicks that many goals in a GF deserves BOG status
To think MAL Greenslade may not have played at full forward had MAL Emmy Jones not broken his leg in 1968, forcing his retirement

A progression of 1969 was that ST scored more goals every time they played
6-10-18-24 the sequence
ST had scored the highest GF score of all SANFL Grand Finals at that stage

GL 44-69
ST 58-46

GL had 113 scores in the 4 matches ST had 104 in 1969
In every match GL scored more points than goals
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby mal » Tue May 19, 2020 6:24 pm

Interesting finish for 4th and 5th in 1969
With one round to go after RD 19
NA 13-6 ...53.77%....1806 for 1553 against
WT 13-6 ..53.76%.... 1858 for 1598 against

RD 20
ST 14-14 NA 11-14
PA 9-10 WT 16-15

West Torrens therefore finishing 4th, NA 5th
WT 14-6...54,23%....1969 for 1662 against
NA 13-7...53.32 %....1886 for 1651 against

WT rather incredibly won their last 10 matches to make 4th spot[final 4 in those days]
Numbers are of interest for WT fors
RD 19 : 1858 this is the year that footy is said to have started in Melbourne
RD 20 : 1969 in the year 1969

This is a question of sorts
What happens at the end of a minor round if 2 teams finish on identical wins and % ?
This very issue was actually raised on TV after RD19 of the 1969 season by Norwood great Pat Hall and others

In the above instance lets imagine if they BOTH finished on the same wins and the same 53.77% after the 20 rounds
Who deserves to be above the other ?

The teams ended up 1-1 head to head in the minor round
RD9
NA 10-12
WT 3-12

RD19 [had NA won they would have made the finals]
WT 19-13
NA 16-10


Once again which team should finish above the other ?

A :If one of the teams won 2-0 do they deserve a higher finish than the other ?

B:They both finished 1-1 NA had +21 points more scored in the 2 matches and a better % head to head , so they should get though ?

C : Should it go on differential ?
NA 1806-1553 = 253
WT 1858-1598 = 260
WT had more of a differential by 7 points so they should finish above NA ?

D : Any other criteria
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby FOURTH ESTATE » Tue May 19, 2020 10:15 pm

Goes to the next decimal point we made the finals that way in 1991 in the SAAFL
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Let that be a lesson to you Sturt. You don't beat Glenelg 3 times in a row in Grand Finals and get away with it.
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby robranisgod » Tue May 19, 2020 10:41 pm

FOURTH ESTATE wrote:Goes to the next decimal point we made the finals that way in 1991 in the SAAFL


But I think what Mal is saying is what if they have identical percentages. It has never happened but it could. I know in the AFL just a few years ago there was a certain score line in the last minor round match that if it had occurred would have given both teams an identical percentage. And it wasn't an outrageous score line but something along the lines of 100 points to 75 points.
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby mal » Tue May 19, 2020 11:36 pm

I will rephrase
What happens if 2 sides finish with identical wins , for points and against points in the SANFL
Is there a criteria that will have it one side finishes above the other on the premiership table ?

If that should happen then a logic might be to go on the head to heads between the 2 clubs , during that season
They do this in some forms of cricket

Using my rationality
For example these teams meet twice in 1969
NW 18-10 [118]
NA 10-10[70]

NW 15-10 [100]
NA 20-22 [123]

NW should finish above NA by virtue of a 25 point differential
Should either team win both encounters that team should logically finish above the other team

It almost happened in 1947
3RD ST 10-7...1638...1438...53.25
4TH WA10-7...1733-1523....53.23
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby DOC » Wed May 20, 2020 1:22 am

What if both games ended in draws?

Kidding.

Head to head record as per your suggestion.
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby FlyingHigh » Wed May 20, 2020 11:53 am

robranisgod wrote:
Excellent points. In 1961 Torrens attracted the highest average home and away crowds and in a year that they didn't make the four, 1959 they had crowds of over 10,000 people in 13 of the 18 games. The only two games that didn't attract a good crowd were the two games against South.

Torrensville, Thebarton, Hindmarsh, Brompton and Croydon had been the heart of the West Torrens area, and of course, that is where a large amount of the post World War 2 immigrants settled, particularly the Greeks. I came from what is now called Renown Park but was then part of Croydon and players and recently retired past players who lived within one mile of me in the 1960s included Jimmy Slaven, Ron Ashby, Johnny Graham, Glenn Pill, Bob Gibson, Wayne Jackson, Bob WIldy and Russell Virgo. By the early 1970s Milan Faletic, Neville Mead and Terry Homan are the only players I can think of to have come from the former heartland
I never was sure whether giving Torrens the North East was a good move in the first place. They had a stupid rule whereby clubs could purchase a junior from another club for $2,000. Norwood were already poaching Torrens juniors, but when they poached David Payne from North, North woke up to the ruse and paid $2,000 each to Torrens for 17 juniors. Amongst these juniors were Andrew and Darren Jarman and lesser players like Roger Carlaw, who played in a premiership. Sure there were some who didn't make it, but you would have to say that North got some bargains.
Benny Harris went to Port from the North East area and Peter Krieg to Central District.
In about 1982 I heard Johnny Graham go on KGs program and plaintively pleaded with the league to do something about Torrens losing players from their North East zone, but the horse had bolted. In 1983 the league in their wisdom gave the area to Norwood.
We have digressed but it certainly is an interesting, and to me, mostly forgotten part of the SANFL history.


Never knew about this $2000 rule. As a kid playing for Tea Tree Gully in the later '80's there was a photo of Ben Harris in the clubrooms, and I always wondered how he got to Port (of course these days they are neighbouring Councils, another stupid idea!!)
Also, with the Jarman's being at Gaza, I just assumed that was always North because it was closer in to the city, but should they have been Torrens players? And I always assumed Krieg come from the mid-North area
Was the original intention ever for Pertaringa to become Torrens home ground?
In hindsight, would having been putting a new club at Modbury and Elizabeth right from the start and keeping West and Torrens where they were without Woodville a more viable option? Would it have been seen as too much of a risk? Would it have met with resistance from Glenelg, Sturt, South, who in comparison with the west/north-west teams had struggled since WW2?
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby am Bays » Wed May 20, 2020 1:49 pm

FlyingHigh wrote:
Never knew about this $2000 rule. As a kid playing for Tea Tree Gully in the later '80's there was a photo of Ben Harris in the clubrooms, and I always wondered how he got to Port (of course these days they are neighbouring Councils, another stupid idea!!)
Also, with the Jarman's being at Gaza, I just assumed that was always North because it was closer in to the city, but should they have been Torrens players? And I always assumed Krieg come from the mid-North area
Was the original intention ever for Pertaringa to become Torrens home ground?
In hindsight, would having been putting a new club at Modbury and Elizabeth right from the start and keeping West and Torrens where they were without Woodville a more viable option? Would it have been seen as too much of a risk? Would it have met with resistance from Glenelg, Sturt, South, who in comparison with the west/north-west teams had struggled since WW2?


Without want to take this thread off track Woodville were basically brought in to weaken Port on the back of their six in a row during the 1950s. Centrals were put in recognition that, that area of Adelaide was the future population growth area. AS has been discussed the plan was to get rid South at the time, too. (South out Centrals in - stay as an 8 team competition) but when that became to difficult politically Woodville was created and a 10 team comp it became.

It is interesting that the NSW Rugby League did the same in 1967. They brought in Cronulla-Sutherland to weaken St George on the back of their 11 in a row premierships from 1956 to 1966. Cronulla were the equivalent of Woodville established in the adjacent Southern suburbs of the St George area. Penrith entered in 1967 in the growth western suburbs area of Sydney, aka Centrals.

Anyway I sure RIG has a better and more factual recollection of this and I eagerly await his 1970 season summary and JO nomination.

There, thread back on track.
Let that be a lesson to you Port, no one beats the Bays five times in a row in a GF and gets away with it!!!
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby robranisgod » Wed May 20, 2020 3:40 pm

FlyingHigh wrote:
robranisgod wrote:
Excellent points. In 1961 Torrens attracted the highest average home and away crowds and in a year that they didn't make the four, 1959 they had crowds of over 10,000 people in 13 of the 18 games. The only two games that didn't attract a good crowd were the two games against South.

Torrensville, Thebarton, Hindmarsh, Brompton and Croydon had been the heart of the West Torrens area, and of course, that is where a large amount of the post World War 2 immigrants settled, particularly the Greeks. I came from what is now called Renown Park but was then part of Croydon and players and recently retired past players who lived within one mile of me in the 1960s included Jimmy Slaven, Ron Ashby, Johnny Graham, Glenn Pill, Bob Gibson, Wayne Jackson, Bob WIldy and Russell Virgo. By the early 1970s Milan Faletic, Neville Mead and Terry Homan are the only players I can think of to have come from the former heartland
I never was sure whether giving Torrens the North East was a good move in the first place. They had a stupid rule whereby clubs could purchase a junior from another club for $2,000. Norwood were already poaching Torrens juniors, but when they poached David Payne from North, North woke up to the ruse and paid $2,000 each to Torrens for 17 juniors. Amongst these juniors were Andrew and Darren Jarman and lesser players like Roger Carlaw, who played in a premiership. Sure there were some who didn't make it, but you would have to say that North got some bargains.
Benny Harris went to Port from the North East area and Peter Krieg to Central District.
In about 1982 I heard Johnny Graham go on KGs program and plaintively pleaded with the league to do something about Torrens losing players from their North East zone, but the horse had bolted. In 1983 the league in their wisdom gave the area to Norwood.
We have digressed but it certainly is an interesting, and to me, mostly forgotten part of the SANFL history.


Never knew about this $2000 rule. As a kid playing for Tea Tree Gully in the later '80's there was a photo of Ben Harris in the clubrooms, and I always wondered how he got to Port (of course these days they are neighbouring Councils, another stupid idea!!)
Also, with the Jarman's being at Gaza, I just assumed that was always North because it was closer in to the city, but should they have been Torrens players? And I always assumed Krieg come from the mid-North area
Was the original intention ever for Pertaringa to become Torrens home ground?
In hindsight, would having been putting a new club at Modbury and Elizabeth right from the start and keeping West and Torrens where they were without Woodville a more viable option? Would it have been seen as too much of a risk? Would it have met with resistance from Glenelg, Sturt, South, who in comparison with the west/north-west teams had struggled since WW2?


The Jarman's were from Holden Hill and went to Gilles Plains High School. Holden Hill was definitely In the West Torrens area and Andrew Jarman played Under 15s for Torrens. At least four clubs, Central, Norwood, North and Torrens were trying to recruit him. His Grandfather had taken him out to Central where Andrew's uncle had played, but according to Andrew he didn't understand a word the Senior coach was saying. The selling point for North was that Barrie Robran, Andrew's hero to this day, came out to get his signature and Andrew signed with North. The close friend of the Jarman's, Steven Sims, lived nearby and he did originally play at Torrens, before coming to North in 1987.

Peter Krieg's elder brother, Graham, had played for Central when the Tea Tree Gully area had been part of the Central zone and hence Peter went to Central to play for his brother's team despite being in the Torrens area.

Prominent North Adelaide and National administrator, Jack Forrester, was a strong proponent of a team being based around Modbury and he even suggested North relocate there in the late 1950s. I can find no other reference to a team being based at Modbury/Tea Tree Gully until Torrens were given the area in the distribution of the early 1970s.

I don't know whether Pertaringa was intended to be Torrens new home ground but I believe the intention was for Torrens to relocate to a ground in the Modbury area.

And I can't add too much more to AmBays post. His post is fairly much as I understand it.

I wish that we could have access to Trove for the late 1950s and early 1960s to find out what was actually reported at the time. I also would like to know which 4 clubs wanted the 8 team competition to remain and which 4 clubs wanted a 10 team competition. As I have said often, I believe it came down to the casting vote of the League President.
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Re: Jack Oatey Medallists

Postby mal » Wed May 20, 2020 4:23 pm

am Bays wrote:
FlyingHigh wrote:
Never knew about this $2000 rule. As a kid playing for Tea Tree Gully in the later '80's there was a photo of Ben Harris in the clubrooms, and I always wondered how he got to Port (of course these days they are neighbouring Councils, another stupid idea!!)
Also, with the Jarman's being at Gaza, I just assumed that was always North because it was closer in to the city, but should they have been Torrens players? And I always assumed Krieg come from the mid-North area
Was the original intention ever for Pertaringa to become Torrens home ground?
In hindsight, would having been putting a new club at Modbury and Elizabeth right from the start and keeping West and Torrens where they were without Woodville a more viable option? Would it have been seen as too much of a risk? Would it have met with resistance from Glenelg, Sturt, South, who in comparison with the west/north-west teams had struggled since WW2?


Without want to take this thread off track Woodville were basically brought in to weaken Port on the back of their six in a row during the 1950s. Centrals were put in recognition that, that area of Adelaide was the future population growth area. AS has been discussed the plan was to get rid South at the time, too. (South out Centrals in - stay as an 8 team competition) but when that became to difficult politically Woodville was created and a 10 team comp it became.

It is interesting that the NSW Rugby League did the same in 1967. They brought in Cronulla-Sutherland to weaken St George on the back of their 11 in a row premierships from 1956 to 1966. Cronulla were the equivalent of Woodville established in the adjacent Southern suburbs of the St George area. Penrith entered in 1967 in the growth western suburbs area of Sydney, aka Centrals.

Anyway I sure RIG has a better and more factual recollection of this and I eagerly await his 1970 season summary and JO nomination.

There, thread back on track.



To further emphasize your Woodville to weaken Port Adelaide statement
I was a Woodville High School student in the 1970s
The talented kids were either going to play for Woodville or Port Adelaide in both football and cricket

Examples
A league footballer from that school lived at Athol Park and ended up at Woodville
Another league footballer who lived in the adjacent Ottoway ended at Port Adelaide
2 students that ended up playing First Class cricket one played at Woodville , lived in Croydon Park ,the other Port Adelaide area and club

Towards the end of high school , I once asked a teacher why is it so that some of the talented boys were going to either Woodville or Port
He explained the suburb alliance , and also heatedly explained it was to weaken Port Adelaide

The irony of my post is he used Ambays posted wording almost to the word about curbing Ports dominance of the 1950s
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