Ch9 AFL Division 7 - 2015

[morell]

every club with 4 sides to have been in div 7, have lost their dgrade in the past 2 years.

We've been through this a dozen times. Correlation does not causation. We've had drops in numbers, the whole league has had drops in numbers. We've lost whole clubs.

The causes of this are many and varied. Blaming it all on C Grade vs A Grade is specious reasoning at best.

you can do your very best to make me look like a tool on here, but the facts speak for themselves, your cgrade vs agrade proposition might be good for you, but its obviously not working for 4 team clubs - IS IT?

It would be if it was EVEN and balanced.

Your issue is related to unevenness, not different grades.

[Footy Chick]

Morell.......

[marbles]

every club with 4 sides to have been in div 7, have lost their dgrade in the past 2 years.

We've been through this a dozen times. Correlation does not causation. We've had drops in numbers, the whole league has had drops in numbers. We've lost whole clubs.

The causes of this are many and varied. Blaming it all on C Grade vs A Grade is specious reasoning at best.

you can do your very best to make me look like a tool on here, but the facts speak for themselves, your cgrade vs agrade proposition might be good for you, but its obviously not working for 4 team clubs - IS IT?

It would be if it was EVEN and balanced.

Your issue is related to unevenness, not different grades.

u dont seem have any scope for the league as a whole, your whole argument is derived from your backyard, and you have no care for any other club. you just need another quick patch job solution because facing an opposition 3 times in a season makes you all sooky wookie in your own lounge room.

you need to face a long solution for all teams, take your MP jumper off for a day a start caring for a competition that holds integrity, equality and long term sustainability for all clubs, not just yours.

[Q.]

and if you're lucky, you may have to shoo some wildlife and the odd sheep off the oval at half time...

Funny you say this, I was there this morning and there was a pair of Roos grazing the oval.

[BFG]

I hate to say it but I kinda agree with marbles on this one. I do think that if C, D grade teams are good enough that they should be playing against the best opposition available to them

Well then you don't agree with marbles. At all.

but i'm also a realist in that the league would be far more likely to listen to the wishes of a four team club than a club or collection of clubs that have had trouble with numbers in recent times. Another factor is that a club is much more likely to attract players that just wanna have a casual kick if they are assured that they will only be playing against fellow C/D graders. More players brings more revenue to both the clubs and the league and i'm sure this would've been part of the argument that the C/D grade clubs put forth.

Don't disagree with any of this other than players caring whether or not is A grade or C Grade. They don't.

As a C Grader, would you rather have a 10 goal win against an A Grade side, or get belted by an elite C Grade unit? These letters on the front of teams are irrelevant. What matters is their standard. If its even, live and let live!

I get the letter is irrelevant in terms of quality of side, hell I remember getting beat by a phenomenal Henley C grade side in div 6 when they finished 6th. My point is more from a perspective of the financial health of the league, wheras (like it or not) the general footy public has an idea in their head that playing C grade is far less serious and of a lesser standard than "A grade" clubs and therefore tend to attract a more casually minded footy player. In reality some C grade clubs are more than competitive in div 7 and while in an ideal world the 31st -40th best teams would play in div 4, 41st -50th would play in div 5, right down to div 7 the reality is that is never going to be the case. In my opinion, from purely an overall league health point of view, Div 7 should be made up of only A and B grade sides. More players playing football in the SAAFL the better for the league as a whole regardless of what division they are in.

One side clubs would be playing in the C grade competition which, hopefully over time with increased success would see them graduate back to two teams and return to div 7. Obviously this would never happen as it would leave div 7 with too few teams currently but for the long term success of the league and also the division 7 competition I believe that this is the right way forward.

So that is where I "kinda agree" with marbles........ I think

[Footy Chick]

and if you're lucky, you may have to shoo some wildlife and the odd sheep off the oval at half time...

Funny you say this, I was there this morning and there was a pair of Roos grazing the oval.

Cheap lawnmowing

[morell]

every club with 4 sides to have been in div 7, have lost their dgrade in the past 2 years.

We've been through this a dozen times. Correlation does not causation. We've had drops in numbers, the whole league has had drops in numbers. We've lost whole clubs.

The causes of this are many and varied. Blaming it all on C Grade vs A Grade is specious reasoning at best.

you can do your very best to make me look like a tool on here, but the facts speak for themselves, your cgrade vs agrade proposition might be good for you, but its obviously not working for 4 team clubs - IS IT?

It would be if it was EVEN and balanced.

Your issue is related to unevenness, not different grades.

u dont seem have any scope for the league as a whole, your whole argument is derived from your backyard, and you have no care for any other club. you just need another quick patch job solution because facing an opposition 3 times in a season makes you all sooky wookie in your own lounge room.

you need to face a long solution for all teams, take your MP jumper off for a day a start caring for a competition that holds integrity, equality and long term sustainability for all clubs, not just yours.

Sure thing buddy. That's why I've argued, just a few posts ago, that I really feel for the premiers of D7 this year (hint: it won't be Mitchell Park) as they have been robbed of a genuine flag. I am defending Salisbury West, Houghton, Angle Vale, Flinders Uni and St Pauls right to have a legitimate competition. We pay our fees to the league, yet we are receiving an inferior service. I will be requesting our committee look long and hard at seeking financial compensation, not only due to less games resulting in less revenue, but we are obviously getting the budget version of the SAAFL experience, whilst I am assuming, paying the same as other customers.

Long term sustainability for ... the very few huge clubs at the top? or long term sustainability for all affiliates and fee paying members? I can tell you very clearly what isn't sustainable and will result in fewer clubs and therefore fewer players and therefore less money in the league's bank ....

Farcical and unbalanced fixtures.

[morell]

My point is more from a perspective of the financial health of the league, wheras (like it or not) the general footy public has an idea in their head that playing C grade is far less serious and of a lesser standard than "A grade" clubs and therefore tend to attract a more casually minded footy player.

Sort of, except I think the general footy public has an idea in their head that playing Division 7 is far less serious and of a lesser standard and therefore tends to attract a more casually minded footy player.

A grade sides have been playing C Grade sides for donkeys years. It's been fine, would've been fine and everyone would have had a great year, C Grade sides included. Instead, we solved a problem that doesn't exist and ****** up an entire year of football for 6 clubs.

In reality some C grade clubs are more than competitive in div 7 and while in an ideal world the 31st -40th best teams would play in div 4, 41st -50th would play in div 5, right down to div 7 the reality is that is never going to be the case.

It could be, if the league stuck to their guns and promoted and relegated on stricter terms. Each year would have slight variances due to recruitment and expansion, but over time, we would get close.

It got close, actually, until we started letting clubs get away with not being promoted or requesting demotion "because we're a C grade and we like winning so D6 is too hard" and "we lost a heap of money, therefore players, we don't want a year of pain so let us slide". **** that, play where you belong based on your standard and the previous years results.

In my opinion, from purely an overall league health point of view, Div 7 should be made up of only A and B grade sides. More players playing football in the SAAFL the better for the league as a whole regardless of what division they are in.

I dont understand. How does screwing up 7 clubs fixture result in more players? Don't buy into this argument that "C graders only want to play C Graders" as it is a complete myth. Most C graders don't even know what division they're playing in half the time, let alone what grade side they're playing in round 16.

One side clubs would be playing in the C grade competition which, hopefully over time with increased success would see them graduate back to two teams and return to div 7. Obviously this would never happen as it would leave div 7 with too few teams currently but for the long term success of the league and also the division 7 competition I believe that this is the right way forward.

This I agree with. Wingfield sould absolutely be able to play C-whatever.

So that is where I "kinda agree" with marbles........ I think

Thats alright, you're from CLG after all . Hope Coxy and Whyborn are training well.

[Q.]

I won't be complaining if we win a flag.

[Pag]

FFS marbles, its not about the letters in front of the name of the team! Its about the standard at which they play.

C Grade, Purple Grade, Seniors, A Grade, reserves, B grade, Pink Poker Dots grade. Who gives a ****.

Provided the logistics (and game day rules) can be sorted what people care about is having an EVEN and BALANCED competition. Not what letter is in front of the team sheet.

Your complaints about Smithfield and previously Ingle Farm dominating D7 are probably valid, in that they were well and truly above the standard of the division. Direct your issue to the league in regards to player payments, the APPS and mass recruitment rules - THATS where your problem lies, not C Grade vs A Grade.

every club with 4 sides to have been in div 7, have lost their dgrade in the past 2 years.

Haven't Modbury now gone to five sides?

I love that your speaking on behalf of other clubs, however I'd much rather hear a SHOC or TTG person tell me whether or not they've gone back to three sides because of the A Grade v C Grade issue, rather than you assuming from the outside.

[jo172]

every club with 4 sides to have been in div 7, have lost their dgrade in the past 2 years.

We've been through this a dozen times. Correlation does not causation. We've had drops in numbers, the whole league has had drops in numbers. We've lost whole clubs.

The causes of this are many and varied. Blaming it all on C Grade vs A Grade is specious reasoning at best.

you can do your very best to make me look like a tool on here, but the facts speak for themselves, your cgrade vs agrade proposition might be good for you, but its obviously not working for 4 team clubs - IS IT?

It would be if it was EVEN and balanced.

Your issue is related to unevenness, not different grades.

u dont seem have any scope for the league as a whole, your whole argument is derived from your backyard, and you have no care for any other club. you just need another quick patch job solution because facing an opposition 3 times in a season makes you all sooky wookie in your own lounge room.

you need to face a long solution for all teams, take your MP jumper off for a day a start caring for a competition that holds integrity, equality and long term sustainability for all clubs, not just yours.

Sure thing buddy. That's why I've argued, just a few posts ago, that I really feel for the premiers of D7 this year (hint: it won't be Mitchell Park) as they have been robbed of a genuine flag. I am defending Salisbury West, Houghton, Angle Vale, Flinders Uni and St Pauls right to have a legitimate competition. We pay our fees to the league, yet we are receiving an inferior service. I will be requesting our committee look long and hard at seeking financial compensation, not only due to less games resulting in less revenue, but we are obviously getting the budget version of the SAAFL experience, whilst I am assuming, paying the same as other customers.

Long term sustainability for ... the very few huge clubs at the top? or long term sustainability for all affiliates and fee paying members? I can tell you very clearly what isn't sustainable and will result in fewer clubs and therefore fewer players and therefore less money in the league's bank ....

Farcical and unbalanced fixtures.

If you wanted the "full SAAFL" experience you could have nominated for the vacant spot in Div 6

All the arguments you have about why Mitchell Park need not have to do that make just as much sense in favour of Div 8 sides going to Div 7.

FWIW I remain of the view the original Div 7/8 fixture with 9 clubs in each was the right balance.

[Old Dog New Tricks]

every club with 4 sides to have been in div 7, have lost their dgrade in the past 2 years.

We've been through this a dozen times. Correlation does not causation. We've had drops in numbers, the whole league has had drops in numbers. We've lost whole clubs.

The causes of this are many and varied. Blaming it all on C Grade vs A Grade is specious reasoning at best.

you can do your very best to make me look like a tool on here, but the facts speak for themselves, your cgrade vs agrade proposition might be good for you, but its obviously not working for 4 team clubs - IS IT?

It would be if it was EVEN and balanced.

Your issue is related to unevenness, not different grades.

u dont seem have any scope for the league as a whole, your whole argument is derived from your backyard, and you have no care for any other club. you just need another quick patch job solution because facing an opposition 3 times in a season makes you all sooky wookie in your own lounge room.

you need to face a long solution for all teams, take your MP jumper off for a day a start caring for a competition that holds integrity, equality and long term sustainability for all clubs, not just yours.

Sure thing buddy. That's why I've argued, just a few posts ago, that I really feel for the premiers of D7 this year (hint: it won't be Mitchell Park) as they have been robbed of a genuine flag. I am defending Salisbury West, Houghton, Angle Vale, Flinders Uni and St Pauls right to have a legitimate competition. We pay our fees to the league, yet we are receiving an inferior service. I will be requesting our committee look long and hard at seeking financial compensation, not only due to less games resulting in less revenue, but we are obviously getting the budget version of the SAAFL experience, whilst I am assuming, paying the same as other customers.

Long term sustainability for ... the very few huge clubs at the top? or long term sustainability for all affiliates and fee paying members? I can tell you very clearly what isn't sustainable and will result in fewer clubs and therefore fewer players and therefore less money in the league's bank ....

Farcical and unbalanced fixtures.

in your rant to the div 8 clubs not wanting to play in 7, do you pick any irony that theres a spot in div 6 for any club to come up to and yet you choose not to. That is as farcical

[Q.]

It's not as farcical as you suggest, given that there were several C/D teams who originally nominated for D7.

[great catch]

Well wingfield are saying there going to fill 2 sides so I'm guessing they will come in

[marbles]

Division 8 should be called C1 & C1R to officially cut ties with sooky wookies like morrell who still have the nerve to believe its ok to sacrifice the recreational lives of cgraders (cos he has no empathy for their saturday afternoons), but its not ok to leave his poor MINORITY agrade clubs all alone with no div 1 div 2 to cling to

he's having a tough time with the divorce from a marriage that was only working for the bride. the groom has had to skip town unfortunately for him, and he cant move forward and find new better solutions, he is just still so hung up he just wants his marriage back :'(

[jo172]

Hearing on the grapevine that if the clubs vote to even the divisions up on Monday Night by promoting clubs up to fill the gaps in division 3 and division 6 then the first two out of Division 7 to go to Division 6 with be Mitchell Park and Houghton.

At least both will have the opportunity to play in competitions with "integrity"

[BFG]

My point is more from a perspective of the financial health of the league, wheras (like it or not) the general footy public has an idea in their head that playing C grade is far less serious and of a lesser standard than "A grade" clubs and therefore tend to attract a more casually minded footy player.

Sort of, except I think the general footy public has an idea in their head that playing Division 7 is far less serious and of a lesser standard and therefore tends to attract a more casually minded footy player.

A grade sides have been playing C Grade sides for donkeys years. It's been fine, would've been fine and everyone would have had a great year, C Grade sides included. Instead, we solved a problem that doesn't exist and ****** up an entire year of football for 6 clubs.

In reality some C grade clubs are more than competitive in div 7 and while in an ideal world the 31st -40th best teams would play in div 4, 41st -50th would play in div 5, right down to div 7 the reality is that is never going to be the case.

It could be, if the league stuck to their guns and promoted and relegated on stricter terms. Each year would have slight variances due to recruitment and expansion, but over time, we would get close.

It got close, actually, until we started letting clubs get away with not being promoted or requesting demotion "because we're a C grade and we like winning so D6 is too hard" and "we lost a heap of money, therefore players, we don't want a year of pain so let us slide". **** that, play where you belong based on your standard and the previous years results.

In my opinion, from purely an overall league health point of view, Div 7 should be made up of only A and B grade sides. More players playing football in the SAAFL the better for the league as a whole regardless of what division they are in.

I dont understand. How does screwing up 7 clubs fixture result in more players? Don't buy into this argument that "C graders only want to play C Graders" as it is a complete myth. Most C graders don't even know what division they're playing in half the time, let alone what grade side they're playing in round 16.

One side clubs would be playing in the C grade competition which, hopefully over time with increased success would see them graduate back to two teams and return to div 7. Obviously this would never happen as it would leave div 7 with too few teams currently but for the long term success of the league and also the division 7 competition I believe that this is the right way forward.

This I agree with. Wingfield sould absolutely be able to play C-whatever.

So that is where I "kinda agree" with marbles........ I think

Thats alright, you're from CLG after all . Hope Coxy and Whyborn are training well.

I think it would result in more players over time. Winning a flag still entices lots of blokes to particular clubs and if you are in a division with fewer teams it would give you more of a chance of winning one. That might seem like a glass half full approach but I truly believe it would be the best for the long term health of some clubs that are currently struggling. Doesn't mean that we all have to have the same opinion, it would be a pretty boring forum if we did! Yeah coxy and scotty have been great additions, looking forward to seeing what Coxy can do come our first trial

[Old Dog New Tricks]

It's not as farcical as you suggest, given that there were several C/D teams who originally nominated for D7.

good point but that's got nothing to with my point.

[Yank Man]

Hearing on the grapevine that if the clubs vote to even the divisions up on Monday Night by promoting clubs up to fill the gaps in division 3 and division 6 then the first two out of Division 7 to go to Division 6 with be Mitchell Park and Houghton.

At least both will have the opportunity to play in competitions with "integrity"

Angle Vale finished higher than Mitchell Park so they would be the first team up.

[Trader]

I will be requesting our committee look long and hard at seeking financial compensation, not only due to less games resulting in less revenue, but we are obviously getting the budget version of the SAAFL experience, whilst I am assuming, paying the same as other customers.

Dangerous precedent, what happens when your b-grade folds and other clubs want compensation from the decreased revenue at their home game?