Teachers 15.75% with 5 months of back pay.

[Dogwatcher]

Violence is threatened regularly by students/parents/carers and in parts of Adelaide and some country schools regularly occurs.

Maybe they're not running in and out of burning buildings - but firies are trained to deal with those situations. Not debating their job is dangerous and they get paid very well for it. Also, I'm not questioning their right to a pay rise. I'm questioning the way it is handled by the government. Why do the government not fight them when they want a pay rise?

[Squawk]

I can fully understand fireys getting a rise. That's a high-risk, dangerous job.

For the 2% of call outs that actually are a real fire. We wont mention the fact that after 8pm, they only stand up if there is a call out. The rest of the time they watch TV or play squash or the like, before going to bed.

[Squawk]

But why do the government not fight them when they want a pay rise?

2 reasons:

1. Conlon and Caica have links to the firies and UFU.
2. The overall cost of massive pay rises only applies to less than 1,000 staff. Easier to give money away than fight about it on principal.

[BIG SEXY]

everyone is reliant on themselves. surely if a teacher was willing to take on anothe job and therefore work 70 hours a week they would make more money

just because the business makes a profit doesnt mean it goes in my pocket. most self employed people will tell you they dont make a fortune they just prefer to work without anyone to answer to.

as far as the firefighter argument goes, i know kids these days are absolute $hitheads (atleast mine are) but can you draw parallels with people instructing children (most of the time) in the comforts of a class room with people who charge into burning buildings or deal with hazmats all day? seeings as they arent actually standing up squawk perhaps we shouldnt pay them. they are only on a retainer for laying down by the way, not full rate. maybe teachers should only be paid full rate for teaching and a greatly reduced rate when they are marking setting out lessons etc?

[Dogwatcher]

I'm not drawing a comparison to the jobs though BS.
I'm drawing a comparison to the battle for a payrise and why governments of all persuasions handle them differently.

[Squawk]

they are only on a retainer for laying down by the way, not full rate. maybe teachers should only be paid full rate for teaching and a greatly reduced rate when they are marking setting out lessons etc?

Actually, not so. Their pay is based on
a base rate
shift loading
other allowances

To get a firey to work 5 DAYS a week (ie not 2 days, 2 nights and 4 days off), they actually get paid a day working allowance as well - in addition to their shift penalties when they are no longer working shifts! Work that out. As they say, being a firey is "the best second job in the world".

As for teachers working a second job, I'll stand corrected but I think it is prohibited. Indeed, very few public service occupations are allowed to work a second job. Ironically, fireman and ambulance drivers are a couple of occupations who have been allowed to do so over time.

[Bum Crack]

they are only on a retainer for laying down by the way, not full rate. maybe teachers should only be paid full rate for teaching and a greatly reduced rate when they are marking setting out lessons etc?

Actually, not so. Their pay is based on
a base rate
shift loading
other allowances

To get a firey to work 5 DAYS a week (ie not 2 days, 2 nights and 4 days off), they actually get paid a day working allowance as well - in addition to their shift penalties when they are no longer working shifts! Work that out. As they say, being a firey is "the best second job in the world".

As for teachers working a second job, I'll stand corrected but I think it is prohibited. Indeed, very few public service occupations are allowed to work a second job. Ironically, fireman and ambulance drivers are a couple of occupations who have been allowed to do so over time.

My uncle was a fiery at the Darwin Airport and I have never seen anyone have it so good.

[BIG SEXY]

darwin airport fiery would be a cream job!

i dont see too many teachers campaigning for the right to work a 2nd job/harder to earn more money......

[Dogwatcher]

Because the good ones are too knackered after a day at work with no lunch break and then doing marking.
The crap ones are too lazy to get a second job anyway.

[Dutchy]

One thing Ive never been able to get a grip of is what do teachers actually get paid?

[BIG SEXY]

Because the good ones are too knackered after a day at work with no lunch break and then doing marking.
The crap ones are too lazy to get a second job anyway.

good ones are too knackered?! as is everyone else who works 8 hours + a day but they get off their bums and do what has to be done
always seems to be a reason why teachers CANT never why they can

[Dogwatcher]

What do you want from them mate?

[BIG SEXY]

i want the same from teachers as i want from everyone else, dont think you have the toughest job in the world cause you dont, stop whinging and get on with it.

[Dogwatcher]

You only hear their whinging because the government wants to drag out their pay rise request every time they ask for one.

They're entitled to ask for a pay rise. As is every profession.

[BIG SEXY]

i dont deny everyone is entiteled to ask for one, i question whether those in the teaching profession tend to ask for alot more than what they need/deserve (whatever) therefore making it drag out and then when the government decline it they dribble crap about how its not about the money its about conditions for your children...wont somebody think of the children!

[Dogwatcher]

"How about the children" is actually a fair comment.

As in the coverage of the issue I've seen in the past few days, neither the union or government has commented on the 'conditions' that were also part of the debate. What happened to those?

BS - the reason the union asks for a high ball figure is because the government will offer a low ball figure (as generally they know the public will support them in that because, again, teachers are easy to have a kick at).

The union did stuff up this time though in forcing this one to drag on.

[BIG SEXY]

what was the original ask by the union DW?
you dont have to lecture me on negotiations, i didnt go to uni but i understand how it works

isnt the union instructed by its members on what to do?

[smac]

You only hear their whinging because the government wants to drag out their pay rise request every time they ask for one.

They're entitled to ask for a pay rise. As is every profession.

Why do they have to get one though?

Many industries, many businesses, many jobs have had to skip payrises this year because the company has no money spare to offer them. Last I knew, our Government was a little tight on funds so why can't they get away with telling Government workers to back off for a year or two while we get the ship in order?

[wycbloods]

You only hear their whinging because the government wants to drag out their pay rise request every time they ask for one.

They're entitled to ask for a pay rise. As is every profession.

Why do they have to get one though?

Many industries, many businesses, many jobs have had to skip payrises this year because the company has no money spare to offer them. Last I knew, our Government was a little tight on funds so why can't they get away with telling Government workers to back off for a year or two while we get the ship in order?

Unionised labour has very few examples of no pay increasesin the last 12 months. Many have had smaller increases but very few have no increase.

Those who negotiate individually are in a different basket though.

[wycbloods]

For those of you who say being a firey is easy then i would love to see you guys fighting fires and running into houses which are burning down. Yes it is well publicised the "down time" they have in their job at times but i wouldn't think there would be many people willing to do what they do.

Couldn't pay me enough to get me to run into a burning building.