Michael Clarke

[am Bays]

I've checked the figures too whufc and smithy, Clarke has stood up in the past

See his two hundreds agaisnt India in 2004
his 91 in the first test to set up a victory at Lords in 2005 when all the batsmen failed in the 1st dig
His runs against England in 2006 in Adelaide and Perth to allow us to go 3-0 up - especially Adleaide when we were four down and still 94 behind the follow on (5-70 behind soon after)
His runs against Seth Africa in 2009 at Sydney to set up a win (also made runs when we lost in Perth and Melb)
His runs agaisnt England in the live test matches in 2009 (Lords, Birmingam and Leeds)

These are just some that I consider more significant - agaisnt the top 4 ICC ranked nations prior to the commencement of this series. Hardly the stuff of a front runner

He made 2 hundreds in 3 tests at the beginning of 2010.

To say he hasn't stood up in the past is folly. To say he has been given an armchair ride is "head scratching stuff". People forget he was dropped in late 2005 and told to go away and tighten his technique - which he did once he came back. From 2006-07 to India 2010 he really has only had two bad series Seth Africa 2009 and India 2010. So he has produced after being told to go away and get better.

Has he failed along with five other batsmen this series? Yes he has. Has he been disappointing? ******* oath but he is no robinson crusoe.

He is 30 approaching the prime of his career he is in my test side going forward. His average is still above the likes of Taylor, M Waugh and others of our more successful era.

We've lost the series and need to start planning for 2013 (which will be bloody difficult for us to win given the ages of the current english team).

Of the current top seven who are going to be around to win back the ASHES?
Hughes, yes,
Watson, yes,
Ponting no,
Clarke yes,
Hussey, no,
Smith (age wise yes but as a batsman I'm not sure), Haddin unlikely but at 36 his batting will be a pale imitation of what it was a la Marsh and Heal and a lesser extent Gilchrist post 35 years of age.

So to me Clarke HAS to be picked for Sydney and will be on the plane to Sri Lanka and South Africa in August September. However I do believe he needs to be tapped on the shoulder and told, mate eschew to T20 and concentrate on teh ODIs and tests.

As S Waugh said after Adelaide we need to pick guys with an eye for the future now and for mine Clarke based on his record is one for our future.

[whufc]

I've checked the figures too whufc and smithy, Clarke has stood up in the past

See his two hundreds agaisnt India in 2004
his 91 in the first test to set up a victory at Lords in 2005 when all the batsmen failed in the 1st dig
His runs against England in 2006 in Adelaide and Perth to allow us to go 3-0 up - especially Adleaide when we were four down and still 94 behind the follow on (5-70 behind soon after)
His runs against Seth Africa in 2009 at Sydney to set up a win (also made runs when we lost in Perth and Melb)
His runs agaisnt England in the live test matches in 2009 (Lords, Birmingam and Leeds)

These are just some that I consider more significant - agaisnt the top 4 ICC ranked nations prior to the commencement of this series. Hardly the stuff of a front runner

He made 2 hundreds in 3 tests at the beginning of 2010.

To say he hasn't stood up in the past is folly. To say he has been given an armchair ride people forget he was dropped in late 2005 and told to go away and tighten his technique - which he did once he came back. From 2006-07 to India 2010 he really has only had two bad series Seth Africa 2009 and India 2010. So he has produced after being told to go away and get better.

Has he failed along with five other batsmen this series yes he has. Has he been disappointing you betcha.

He is 30 approaching the prime of his career he is a 'keeper IMO. His average is still above the likes of Taylor, M Waugh and others of our more successful era.

We've lost the series and need to start planning for 2013 (which will be bloody difficult for us to win given the ages of the current english team).

Of the current top seven who are going to be around to win back the ASHES, Hughes, yes, Watson, yes, Ponting no, Clarke yes, Hussey, no, Smith (age wise yes but as a batsman I'm not sure), Haddin unlikely but at 36 his batting will be a pale imitation of what it was a la Marsh and Heal and a lesser extent Gilchrist post 35 years of age.

So to me Clarke HAS to be picked for Sydney and will be on the plane to Sri Lanka and South Africa in August September. However I do believe he needs to be tapped on the shoulder and told, mate eschew to T20 and concentrate on teh ODIs and tests.

Thats more my point right there, we need to prepare for that series, Clarke would be 32ish by then and having had plenty of back issues im sure he will be far from being at his 'prime' by then.

Australia needs to blood new batsmen to be ready for that series and right at this moment in time Hussey cant be dropped on form, Ponting is the captain so wont be dropped as he is the only current option for captain, there is no way Clarke could be given the captaincy with his current form, so how do we blood new players into the side.

I dont have a problem with Clarke coming back into the side but i think he really needs to go back to the Shield and find his form and then come back into the line up at number 5

This is my ideal top 6 in preparation for 2013 Ashes

1. Hughes
2. Maddinson
3. Watson (would love to see him bat at 3 and play as a batsmen only)
4. Khawaja/Ferguson/any young batsmen making runs on a consistent basis
5. Hussey (only while his in form)
6. Ponting (until a better captaining option becomes available)

[Hondo]

In cricket terms these days 32 is right in the zone of a batsman's prime IMO. Most play to 35+ now so he'd have another 3-5 years after the 2013 Ashes. whufc, I'm a broken record i know but I think you are changing the rules to suit your argument against Clarke. Now at 32 he will be retiring whereas everyone else is playing on to 36 in your crystal ball. He wouldn't be the first player to overcome an injury and come back strongly.

I think am bays is right. He's a key part of the next 5 years once Hussey and Ponting go in the next 2. He may not be the captain but if we aren't playing Clarke in 2013 we must have a very strong side.

There's no point apologising for Hughes all the time and gifting him prized test caps as a project player forever. I don't agree that you can only improve your game at test level. Most of the best players have improved away from the spotlight and top level opponents forever probing their weaknesses.

Also, Hussey won't be playing the 2013 Ashes. He'd be 39! How quickly we forget his terrible form slump which came back to haunt him this test. How can you argue for blooding new players while you write Mr Cricket a blank cheque to play as long as he wants? Will you jump back on board Clarke if he scores 2 tons in 3 tests? He's very likely to do that soon. Therefore, he's locked in for as long as he wants and all is forgiven on your argument.

[am Bays]

MAte Ponting reminds me of S Waugh, Boon, M Waugh, Gilchrist, Hayden and Langer (last four tests) in the twilight/last year of their careers the mind is willing/wanting but the body ain't letting them do what they want.

As much as I hate to say it stick fork in Punter he's done at test level.

I was all for him playing this series he had the credits but with barely a 100 runs in 8 digs sorry.

I can see Hussey lasting another year but I wonder if the mental effort of lifting himself for the series when he was all but cooked until his last dig prior to the first test has got me wondering if he can go on much longer?

if your prepared to let Hughes (with a vastly inferior test record than Clarke) stay up top when he has bigger batting issues than Clarke IMO, when the Clarke has to stay too.

Yes our top six hasn't stood up this year but where are the other batsmen knocking at the door demanding selection. Over half of Khawajas runs (300/580) have come agaisnt South Australia in 3/10 digs. Maddison has had 7 digs this year for 350 runs, 105 of those runs agaisnt SA. A bit like filling your boots agaisnt the Bangas before you play the Saffas!!!

In the one game this eyar when Clarke played with Usman against the best attack in the Shield for teh past three years (Victoria's) Clarke tonned up Usman only made 23.

So unlike the golden era of the 90s and 1st half of 00s, when you had the likes of Siddens, Cox, Hills, Law, Barsby, etc we've had no-one really this year putting their hand up to say pick me instead of these blokes. No pressure on our current top six making them make runs. Where as our top six of 15, 10 and 5 years ago knew if they didn't make runs their were at least three blokes outside the side queing up to take their place.

[whufc]

If Clarkes back problems are as persisant as has been reported he will be struggling to play regular cricket within 2-3 years.

This is something i have gone through.

[Q.]

He's batting terribly at the moment and I am a huge critic of him, however, I am 100% certain he can regain his form while remaining in the 1st XI and is easily among this country's top 6 batsmen. Keep him in the side.

I think it's a little foolish to cull all of our experienced players at once - the rookies have much to learn from them - but one of Hussey or Ponting has to go in the next 3-6 months to open up a position for a young fella.

[am Bays]

If Clarkes back problems are as persisant as has been reported he will be struggling to play regular cricket within 2-3 years.

This is something i have gone through.

Key word bolded. If as you say is true and he can't make runs over an extended period time - next 3-4 series yep drop him - only currency of value is runs.

But you don't drop experienced players based on an if and maybe.

[EasyE]

Clarke should never have been selected for the tour of South Africa 5 or 6 years back, 2 tests after Hodge scored a double ton - and then got dumped!!!! If i remember correctly he had done very little for NSW that season yet at the time he was the current NSW golden boy who didn't need performances in the shield to justify selection. Sound familiar?

As horrible as he looked batting today, i've never seen him try a stupid front foot pull like the current NSW golden boy did. How about bringing in a couple of experienced shield cricketers like Marsh, White or Klinger into the side for the 5th test? They would at least be able to bat properly, which would be a step in the right direction. I believe India and South Africa are touring here the next 2 summers followed by the 2013 Ashes. Unless something drastic is done soon, it could be a messy few years for Australian cricket........

[Jim05]

Dont look too far ahead. Unless changes made asap we wont be a match for nz or bangladesh

[Gozu]

Look I dislike Michael Clarke probably as much as anybody, I've always considered him a front runner who's average for NSW never warranted Test selection in the first place, hyped up and like Ian Chappell said last year no where near as good a player of spin as the myth stands.

BUT as poorly as he is batting recently he has performed well as Test level for years now. Yes, I believe he's starting to be found out against decent bowling but he doesn't deserve to be dropped and it's a long time until we play Test cricket again anyway so in saying that:

As I have said all series Ponting should be tapped on the shoulder after this Test and told to retire in Sydney or otherwise he will miss out on selection in Test cricket in the future. I'd also drop Hughes and bring Katich back for his final Test match. Obviously Nathan Hauritz should be played ahead of the likes of Steve Smith too:

Another recent Australian representative, Nathan Hauritz, is enjoying his return to domestic cricket this season. Dropped before the start of the Ashes series, the off-spinner has been in terrific form for NSW, taking 19 wickets and plundering 332 runs from six matches in the Sheffield Shield. But he is not expecting a late recall to the Australian team.

http://www.smh.com.au/sport/cricket/kat ... 199aa.html

[am Bays]

Clarke should never have been selected for the tour of South Africa 5 or 6 years back, 2 tests after Hodge scored a double ton - and then got dumped!!!! If i remember correctly he had done very little for NSW that season yet at the time he was the current NSW golden boy who didn't need performances in the shield to justify selection. Sound familiar?

Hodge was dropped for the return of Martyn for the South African tour of 2006. Clarke was still banished to the Shield back then.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/238201.html

[Rik E Boy]

This is my ideal top 6 in preparation for 2013 Ashes

1. Hughes
2. Maddinson
3. Watson (would love to see him bat at 3 and play as a batsmen only)
4. Khawaja/Ferguson/any young batsmen making runs on a consistent basis
5. Hussey (only while his in form)
6. Ponting (until a better captaining option becomes available)

Ponting? BWAHAHA. Can't score a run now let alone in four years time. Only the Poms of old pick a bloke to be captain when he isn't making runs. Also, Ponting couldn't captain Australia to the Ashes with the 2005 attack so how the hell could you expect him to lead the greenhorns to the Ashes against seasoned English opposition in 2013?? As far as better captaining options are available I'd back Clarke, Haddin, Katich, Hussey, White and Watson as better options as long as they don't get the gig the minute they are about to jump on the Jumbo.

Forget about the Clarkey bashing PONTING IS GONE. If he stays we'll continue to suck.

regards,

REB

[am Bays]

Forget about the Clarkey bashing PONTING IS GONE. If he stays we'll continue to suck.

regards,

REB

Punter hasn't been the same since he moved to NSW.....

[Rik E Boy]

Look I dislike Michael Clarke probably as much as anybody, I've always considered him a front runner who's average for NSW never warranted Test selection in the first place

And yet many of the posters on this forum are suggesting that Ferguson should be considered for the Baggy Green despite having a similar first class average.

regards,

REB

[whufc]

This is my ideal top 6 in preparation for 2013 Ashes

1. Hughes
2. Maddinson
3. Watson (would love to see him bat at 3 and play as a batsmen only)
4. Khawaja/Ferguson/any young batsmen making runs on a consistent basis
5. Hussey (only while his in form)
6. Ponting (until a better captaining option becomes available)

Ponting? BWAHAHA. Can't score a run now let alone in four years time. Only the Poms of old pick a bloke to be captain when he isn't making runs. Also, Ponting couldn't captain Australia to the Ashes with the 2005 attack so how the hell could you expect him to lead the greenhorns to the Ashes against seasoned English opposition in 2013?? As far as better captaining options are available I'd back Clarke, Haddin, Katich, Hussey, White and Watson as better options as long as they don't get the gig the minute they are about to jump on the Jumbo.

Forget about the Clarkey bashing PONTING IS GONE. If he stays we'll continue to suck.

regards,

REB

sorry i didnt mean he would be their in 2013, i just dont think we can drop Ponting as it stands right now while there isnt a next captain in waiting, Clarke is probably the only option but cant hit a run at the moment himself so he cant be made captain.

[Rik E Boy]

Forget about the Clarkey bashing PONTING IS GONE. If he stays we'll continue to suck.

regards,

REB

Punter hasn't been the same since he moved to NSW.....

An unhappy coincidence. The decline of Ponting is just horrible to witness. At his peak Ricky was on a par with Greg Chappell but the longer he plays the less likely that comparison is going to be committed to posterity. In recent years the decline has been gradual but it has becoming an alarming and much more rapid decline of late. The more he wants to succeed, the more rapid this decline has become. When you can't make runs even after my kiss of death then it's time he was tapped on the shoulder.

regards,

REB

[Rik E Boy]

sorry i didnt mean he would be their in 2013, i just dont think we can drop Ponting as it stands right now while there isnt a next captain in waiting, Clarke is probably the only option but cant hit a run at the moment himself so he cant be made captain.

My team for Bangladesh

Katich
Hughes
Watson
Hussey
Khawaja
White
Haddin
Johnson
Hauritz
Siddle
Copeland

12th Madinson

As skipper I'd have White or Katich, two players who have lead their states to the Sheffield Shield. Ponting cannot remain in the side just because he is captain becaue he is a 5hit captain anyway.

regards,

REB

[whufc]

sorry i didnt mean he would be their in 2013, i just dont think we can drop Ponting as it stands right now while there isnt a next captain in waiting, Clarke is probably the only option but cant hit a run at the moment himself so he cant be made captain.

My team for Bangladesh

Katich
Hughes
Watson
Hussey
Khawaja
White
Haddin
Johnson
Hauritz
Siddle
Copeland

12th Madinson

As skipper I'd have White or Katich, two players who have lead their states to the Sheffield Shield. Ponting cannot remain in the side just because he is captain becaue he is a 5hit captain anyway.

regards,

REB

Thats my argument, you make Katich captain he has probably only got 2 years at most left in test cricket plus his coming back from a difficult injury so their is no guarentee he will be in form.

White is a great captain but the bloke is 28 and hasnt even cemented his own spot in the side, there is no way you could make him captain, he might not even be up to test standard as a batsmen. He is a bloke that should have been giving a go from a younger age ala as Steve Smith is now.

[Rik E Boy]

If you pick Smith instead of White, Maddinson instead of Katich then you only have Hussey and Haddin as the experienced men in the batting line up. Batsmen get better as they mature. Smith shouldn't be in the side end of story. White is at a perfect stage in his career to put into the team. Why can't you play White?? Pick him and back him. We are flogging a dead horse with Ponting and Pup needs a spell. As for Katich yeah he is a senior citizen and has had some injuries but he should still be able to provide two years service so that will give Hughes the time to attain some seniority until Maddinson graduates. Katich should be reintroduced to the top order which is dire need of someone who knows his game and knows where the off stick is.

My arguement is ANYONE IS BETTER THAN PONTING. Tactical retard and now a walking wicket.

regards,

REB

[whufc]

If you pick Smith instead of White, Maddinson instead of Katich then you only have Hussey and Haddin as the experienced men in the batting line up. Batsmen get better as they mature. Smith shouldn't be in the side end of story. White is at a perfect stage in his career to put into the team. Why can't you play White?? Pick him and back him. We are flogging a dead horse with Ponting and Pup needs a spell. As for Katich yeah he is a senior citizen and has had some injuries but he should still be able to provide two years service so that will give Hughes the time to attain some seniority until Maddinson graduates. Katich should be reintroduced to the top order which is dire need of someone who knows his game and knows where the off stick is.

My arguement is ANYONE IS BETTER THAN PONTING. Tactical retard and now a walking wicket.

regards,

REB

dont get me wrong i would love to see White come into the side but do you really believe you could thrust the captaincy on him straight away, i mean the bloke has played stuff all 5 day cricket never mind captain it.