Who will get sacked first?

[GWW]

Wrong GWW due to A Stewarts recruitment the Power won a Premiership in 2004 and played in another Grand Final in 2007 the problem is the recruitment and coaching staff and also its really NOT Port any more its just another useless AFL/VFL club.

Thats a pretty definitive (biased?) statement, one I'll disagree with.

The 2 main players in Port's initial squad were Tredrea and Wanganeen. Both were going to play at Port regardless of what Stewart did. Chad Cornes was a win in an early draft.

Heuskes was more problems than he was worth. There was a lot of rubbish in the initial squad such as Freeborn, Scott Bassett.

Lets have a look at his drafting, starting from 2000.

Wakelin for pick 4 was a win.

Early pick for Bode, that got them S Burgoyne, another win.

Kane Cornes at pick 20, he was good in early years, been average last few years. Accumulates possessions, but does very little with them. Allan Murray in pick 30's, rubbish pick. Cassisi at pick 50, good.

**Johncock overlooked and taken by Crows at pick the 60's.

2001 - Barry Brooks pick 15 - fail; Hardwick for picks 37 and 41, good, although he had no choice but to leave Essendon due to salary cap issues. Damon White pick 62 - average; Poulton pick 76 - ok as late pick

2002 - Salopek - pick 6, bordering on a pass mark; Gilham pick 16 - fail; Brett Ebert - father son - recruiter can't really take credit/blame either way for a father/son; Champion pick 57 - fail;

2003 - Chaplin - pick 15 - bordering on pass mark. Pick 15 is a lot to pay for a key defender who hasn't proved themself completely nearly 8 years later though; Pick 30 - Symes - fail; Pick 39 - Forster Knight - FAIL!!; Pick 46 - Pettigrew - average, although didn't develop as well as the club would have liked;

2004 - 2 picks within first 20 - Thomson and Willits - big fail! - He was reported as saying this draft was his parting gift to the club, some irony there.

I stand corrected, but I think he also responsible for such illustrious pick as Paul Koulouritis and Michael Stevens. Adam Morgan as the 18 year old selection.

Positives - C Cornes; Hardwick and Mahoney for not giving up much; Wakelin for pick 4. S Burgoyne from pick they got from Bode;

Negatives - way too many busts

Its the players from that era - early 2000's that should now be playing a key role in the team. Instead the clubs is increasingly relying on playes from more recent drafts - Hartlett, Trengove, Boak, Westhoff, Wingard, Carlile, Gray, Redden.

[GWW]

Not sure recruiting officers have much to do with effort on the field, but a coach certainly does.

I dont care if you are draft pick no. 1 or 2000 100% effort levels should be identical.

Has there ever been a ruckman who has gone on to be a successful coach?

Stewart isn't responsible for the inept and spineless efforts of the players yesterday, however he had a significant input into the squad as it stands today.

Williams also too needs to share some of the blame as well.

[JK]

IIRC Stewart was the man responsible for the assembly of Port's initial squad .. Over time he can probably claim credit for Tredrea, Roger James, Nick Stevens, the Burgoynes, Francou, Josh Carr, Stewart Dew etc.

I've never personally met him, but I've never heard anything but the highest of praise for his ability and eye for talent, from insiders of the football community.

No recruiter will ever strike Gold everytime, it just doesn't happen .. There will always be some bust players.

[GWW]

IIRC Stewart was the man responsible for the assembly of Port's initial squad .. Over time he can probably claim credit for Tredrea, Roger James, Nick Stevens, the Burgoynes, Francou, Josh Carr, Stewart Dew etc.

I've never personally met him, but I've never heard anything but the highest of praise for his ability and eye for talent, from insiders of the football community.

No recruiter will ever strike Gold everytime, it just doesn't happen .. There will always be some bust players.

Some busts sure, but he had a higher than acceptable failure rate.

Not sure he can take credit for Tredrea really. He was always going to be in there.

Stevens had a negative impact on the playing group.

Francou had come off a Magarey Medal so was probably always going to get a go given limited recruiting concessions afforded to the club.

Carr was certainly a positive. But I stand by my comments that his performance as a recruiter is quite over-rated.

[JK]

IIRC Stewart was the man responsible for the assembly of Port's initial squad .. Over time he can probably claim credit for Tredrea, Roger James, Nick Stevens, the Burgoynes, Francou, Josh Carr, Stewart Dew etc.

I've never personally met him, but I've never heard anything but the highest of praise for his ability and eye for talent, from insiders of the football community.

No recruiter will ever strike Gold everytime, it just doesn't happen .. There will always be some bust players.

Some busts sure, but he had a higher than acceptable failure rate.

Not sure he can take credit for Tredrea really. He was always going to be in there.

Stevens had a negative impact on the playing group.

Francou had come off a Magarey Medal so was probably always going to get a go given limited recruiting concessions afforded to the club.

Carr was certainly a positive. But I stand by my comments that his performance as a recruiter is quite over-rated.

Starting to sound like a beat-up mate .. Stewart was charged with responsibility for assembling the initial squad I believe, and if that is the case and Tredrea was in it, then he should get the credit for it .. Same with Mead and Wilson.

Stevens played plenty of football for you, and you got nothing in return by virtue of the club refusing to accept what little they could have received, and a harsh reality of the system (that makes it so easy for an uncontracted player to find his way to the bottom ranked club) .. He quickly became a whipping boy of Port fans who were prepared to overlook Carr doing virtually the same thing.

I don't think his performance has been over-rated, and without doing the research (ie, gut feel) I would say the Crows drafting/recruiting has been better since he made his way to West Lakes.

[GWW]

Ok mate, we'll agree to disgree there.

[GWW]

And I also don't think the Crows recruiting got any better until Rendell joined them.

[on the rails]

Gilham a failed pick??? More like complete lack of opportunity and I suppose that is Stewart's fault? Traded to Hawthorn and won a flag once given the opportunity!

[robranisgod]

Gilham a failed pick??? More like complete lack of opportunity and I suppose that is Stewart's fault? Traded to Hawthorn and won a flag once given the opportunity!

I was about to say the same thing OTR. How many games did Gilham play for the Power? Was it one? Looks like someone stuffed up big time with that one, and I don't think it was the recruiter.

[Grahaml]

Stewart's job was to pick the talent, not to develop it and maximise the output on the field. Every pick is a lottery to an extent, some punts come off (Buddy Franklin was considered by all a huge risk so high) some don't (Angwin could have been a great for the talent he had). A recruiter can't be held accountable for every decision the club and player makes forever more. To blame Alan Stewart for what ended up happening with Nick Stevens is about as dumb an idea as safooty has seen, which is no mean feat. I guess not hanging on to Tom Harley is another Stewart error, as was Bowen Lockwood's injury troubles. Heck, let's also blame Stewart for the mess that Mark Williams' departure ended up being and Port's overall financial situation while we're deciding to blame the guy for things that weren't anything to do with him.

I think it's important to note that his role at the Crows is in fact different, so comparing Crows drafting with Port's and giving Stewart the credit/blame is unfair.

[Booney]

Gilham a failed pick??? More like complete lack of opportunity and I suppose that is Stewart's fault? Traded to Hawthorn and won a flag once given the opportunity!

I was about to say the same thing OTR. How many games did Gilham play for the Power? Was it one? Looks like someone stuffed up big time with that one, and I don't think it was the recruiter.

People forget who was in front of the player when he was on the list and what the player was like when he was on the list.

Also, Gilham has had one good season, 2008 and we all know how good Hawthorn were in 2008.

Gilham was Rookie Listed by Hawthorn in the 2006 draft after one game with Port.

So when delisted at the end of 2005 we had on our list ( tall defenders ) :

Chad Cornes
Darryl Wakelin
Mathew Bishop
Michael Pettigrew
Troy Chaplin
Damon White / Toby Thurstans ( both of these played forward and back at times )

Was a young Gilham ever getting picked ahead of any of them?No.

Cornes and Wakelin held our Premiership defence together in '04 and Wakelin retired in 07, so you cant say they were both ageing and needed support.

Bishop the same. Pettigrew showed much promise then ( more than Gilham anyway ) to be kept on the list and a young Chaplin was beginning to impress. White and Thurstans who some may argue never got a fair go were forwards who played in the back half at times.

[The Sleeping Giant]

Back on topic please.

[Booney]

Back on topic please.

Talk about over moderating....

[GWW]

Gilham a failed pick??? More like complete lack of opportunity and I suppose that is Stewart's fault? Traded to Hawthorn and won a flag once given the opportunity!

Given the players who Booney listed as being established defenders at the club already, spending a first round pick on him - albeit pick 16 - probably wasn't a priority.

2002 wasn't a particularly strong draft though so its not as big an issue as some other selections.

[GWW]

Stewart's job was to pick the talent, not to develop it and maximise the output on the field. Every pick is a lottery to an extent, some punts come off (Buddy Franklin was considered by all a huge risk so high) some don't (Angwin could have been a great for the talent he had). A recruiter can't be held accountable for every decision the club and player makes forever more. To blame Alan Stewart for what ended up happening with Nick Stevens is about as dumb an idea as safooty has seen, which is no mean feat. I guess not hanging on to Tom Harley is another Stewart error, as was Bowen Lockwood's injury troubles. Heck, let's also blame Stewart for the mess that Mark Williams' departure ended up being and Port's overall financial situation while we're deciding to blame the guy for things that weren't anything to do with him.

I think it's important to note that his role at the Crows is in fact different, so comparing Crows drafting with Port's and giving Stewart the credit/blame is unfair.

I wasn't the one who initially brought up Stewart's name. I was responding to someone else who said the club had fallen apart since he left. I was giving an opinion that his contribution as recruiter is over-rated.

Yes, he can't really be blamed for the Stevens issue, but then again clubs do interview players and if there are any perceived issues re attitude thats when its to be picked up.

Also, saying that recruiters only recruit and don't develop is a bit of a cop-out for recruiters to blame someone else. Look at his early selections - Michael Stevens, Brooks, Koloroutis. All had opportunities at other clubs who weren't able to develop them either.

My point still stands that there is not a significant amount of quality on the list from Stewart's era as recruiter.

I never brought up poor administration,/Choco's contract (which I fully admit were major stuff ups) as being anything to do with Stewart, but I did mention Choco needed to share a portion of the blame.

[Aerie]

It wasn't as simple as the thrashing they copped in the 2007 Grand Final that sent them spiralling down?

Up until that point the AFL version of Port Adelaide had pretty well carried on the proud tradition Port Adelaide had created many years prior, including making that 2007 GF when they probably shouldn't have. Since then it all seems to have fallen apart.

To me the Power list doesn't look that bad. If I was a prospective coach I wouldn't mind building a team around the likes of Trengrove, Boak, Hartlett and Butcher. I don't think Primus is that man though and would be surprised to see him at the helm next season.

As for the Magpies, what has happened? They peaked in Round 1? Still time for them to get back in the season though.

[GWW]

That's a fairly reasonable post Aerie. 2007 had a significant impact on the squad.

I also think when Brian Cunningham left the club, that was a significant point, after which the club's administration deteriorated.

All up there's a combination of factors.

As for the Magpies, I'm not sure thats as easy to evaluate, although I do think they may have gotten ahead of themself in pre-season games when played trials with nearly full strength squads against depleted opposition.

The disappointing form of Wilson compared to the trials appear to be another factor, although by no means am I blaming him for the current plight of the side.

[Slots It Through]

That's a fairly reasonable post Aerie. 2007 had a significant impact on the squad.

I also think when Brian Cunningham left the club, that was a significant point, after which the club's administration deteriorated.

All up there's a combination of factors.

As for the Magpies, I'm not sure thats as easy to evaluate, although I do think they may have gotten ahead of themself in pre-season games when played trials with nearly full strength squads against depleted opposition.

The disappointing form of Wilson compared to the trials appear to be another factor, although by no means am I blaming him for the current plight of the side.

With regards to the magpies, i dont think it was the club that was getting ahead of themselves, there was a fair bit of hype, but majority of which was coming from the media.

[locky801]

Back on topic please.

Geez I actually agree, you want to have a debate about the ins and outs etc start up a new thread

[GWW]

With regards to the magpies, i dont think it was the club that was getting ahead of themselves, there was a fair bit of hype, but majority of which was coming from the media.

Yeah fair point. May have been subconscious perhaps.