AFL Reserves Discussion...

[UK Fan]

I'm not the one citing an irrational reason.

I don't care what you vote as you don't have one, and I'm happy with the status quo.

I'm simply calling you out on you reason for preferring the crows model over ports.[/quote]


Irrational ???

[TimmiesChin]

Irrational ???

You preferred the crows model because it gives you a recruiting zone that in the balance of probability you would get in either model.

Are you more motivated to keep reserves out or simply to get a bigger recruiting zone for centrals?

[UK Fan]

Irrational ???

You preferred the crows model because it gives you a recruiting zone that in the balance of probability you would get in either model.

Are you more motivated to keep reserves out or simply to get a bigger recruiting zone for centrals?

So port are going to keep its recruiting zones but give them back at the same time ???

[Hazydog]

Can someone tell me why the Port model has been shut down so much? Is it the inequality argument only? On face value, the Port model seems to do less damage to the SANFL than Adelaides does.

I've thought about this and find my reasoning kind of contradicts itself - but here goes anyway.

Mainly, that the concept of having a team playing in the League competition which could not fully focus on a 100% commitment to win the Premiership would water down the integrity of the competition. (ie playing 3 ruckmen, playing kids who were getting a game because they were on the AFL list at the expense of a better player, playing someone for a half because they were resuming from an injury, putting rehab for the following season before playing in the latter stages of the season etc.) Obviously this reasoning also applies to the Crows model as well.

Just supposing though that the Power could guarantee that all of the above wouldnt happen - (dont see how they could personally), and that they would be fully committed, I then wonder whether the Magpies would have too much of an advantage over the others? We have already seen them gain an SANFL recruit on the basis of being offered employment by the AFL arm, and the lure of getting fast tracked into the AFL system would be an advantage they could offer to any prospective recruit. In some ways this situation has already reared its head since the introduction of the "One Club" restructure, and I assume the only reason it hasnt been addressed by the SANFL is because the whole AFL Reserves discussion/decision was looming on the horizon and one way or the other would remove the issue.

Anyway - like I say, I know I've contradicted myself so line up for the pots now...

[TimmiesChin]

Irrational ???

So port are going to keep its recruiting zones but give them back at the same time ???

They have already stated they would keep some and give some back. Logic would say Salisbury would be ripe for the picking, I'd imagine logically they would kept the immediate port Adelaide region and some of the country.

[PhilH]

And the way the boundaries commission works no club would be majorly advantaged by Ports zone being reduced / eliminated.

Whatever one club picks up, they would probably lose a part of their existing zone and so on until all 8 clubs picked up about 11-14% of numbers the Port zone gave up.

[Mr Beefy]

Can someone tell me why the Port model has been shut down so much? Is it the inequality argument only? On face value, the Port model seems to do less damage to the SANFL than Adelaides does.

Mainly, that the concept of having a team playing in the League competition which could not fully focus on a 100% commitment to win the Premiership would water down the integrity of the competition. (ie playing 3 ruckmen, playing kids who were getting a game because they were on the AFL list at the expense of a better player, playing someone for a half because they were resuming from an injury, putting rehab for the following season before playing in the latter stages of the season etc.) Obviously this reasoning also applies to the Crows model as well.

Perhaps a better option would then be to allow Port's SANFL league team to be picked on merit, etc and also allow Port's AFL spuds (and those coming back from injury, 3rd ruckman, etc) to play SANFL reserves?

[gossipgirl]

Definition of Integrity so it never gets used again in this thread

Integrity is a concept of consistency of actions, values, methods, measures, principles, expectations, and outcomes. In ethics, integrity is regarded as the honesty and truthfulness or accuracy of one's actions. Integrity can be regarded as the opposite of hypocrisy,[1] in that integrity regards internal consistency as a virtue, and suggests that parties holding apparently conflicting values should account for the discrepancy or alter their beliefs.

The word "integrity" stems from the Latin adjective integer (whole, complete).[2] In this context, integrity is the inner sense of "wholeness" deriving from qualities such as honesty and consistency of character. As such, one may judge that others "have integrity" to the extent that they act according to the values, beliefs and principles they claim to hold.

A value system's abstraction depth and range of applicable interaction may also function as significant factors in identifying integrity due to their congruence or lack of congruence with observation. A value system may evolve over time[3] while retaining integrity if those who espouse the values account for and resolve inconsistencies.[4]

[TimmiesChin]

Can someone tell me why the Port model has been shut down so much? Is it the inequality argument only? On face value, the Port model seems to do less damage to the SANFL than Adelaides does.

Mainly, that the concept of having a team playing in the League competition which could not fully focus on a 100% commitment to win the Premiership would water down the integrity of the competition. (ie playing 3 ruckmen, playing kids who were getting a game because they were on the AFL list at the expense of a better player, playing someone for a half because they were resuming from an injury, putting rehab for the following season before playing in the latter stages of the season etc.) Obviously this reasoning also applies to the Crows model as well.

Perhaps a better option would then be to allow Port's SANFL league team to be picked on merit, etc and also allow Port's AFL spuds (and those coming back from injury, 3rd ruckman, etc) to play SANFL reserves?

You mean like they currently do ?

[UK Fan]

Irrational ???

So port are going to keep its recruiting zones but give them back at the same time ???

They have already stated they would keep some and give some back. Logic would say Salisbury would be ripe for the picking, I'd imagine logically they would kept the immediate port Adelaide region and some of the country.

Oh well you see the crows have stated they wont keep any and give the rest back.

Thus the RATIONAL advantage to centrals of crows bid over ports which was in answer to Maccas original question.

Ofcourse we want both options rejected are they are both a disgrace to the SANFL!!!!!!

[The Sleeping Giant]

I love how Centrals supporters keep going on about getting those zones back, because you had so much success when you had them, and Port have been so successful with them.

[CENTURION]

I love how Centrals supporters keep going on about getting those zones back, because you had so much success when you had them, and Port have been so successful with them.

we want them back because they are in our area, the Salisbury Council, not Port Adelaide. PLUS we need all the junior development opportunities we can lay our hands on!

[TimmiesChin]

I love how Centrals supporters keep going on about getting those zones back, because you had so much success when you had them, and Port have been so successful with them.

we want them back because they are in our area, the Salisbury Council, not Port Adelaide. PLUS we need all the junior development opportunities we can lay our hands on!

It may surprise you, but I went through your junior development program many years ago.

Back then centrals did a pretty average job of looking after their zones, in comparison to other clubs. At some point in the 90's something changed and their efforts were increased and I have no doubt this was part of the success you've experienced.

My point is that development is not just about numbers, as all clubs get equalized, but it's about investment into it.

[CENTURION]

I love how Centrals supporters keep going on about getting those zones back, because you had so much success when you had them, and Port have been so successful with them.

we want them back because they are in our area, the Salisbury Council, not Port Adelaide. PLUS we need all the junior development opportunities we can lay our hands on!

It may surprise you, but I went through your junior development program many years ago.

Back then centrals did a pretty average job of looking after their zones, in comparison to other clubs. At some point in the 90's something changed and their efforts were increased and I have no doubt this was part of the success you've experienced.

My point is that development is not just about numbers, as all clubs get equalized, but it's about investment into it.

all clubs get equalised? boy, are you wrong!!

[TimmiesChin]

I love how Centrals supporters keep going on about getting those zones back, because you had so much success when you had them, and Port have been so successful with them.

we want them back because they are in our area, the Salisbury Council, not Port Adelaide. PLUS we need all the junior development opportunities we can lay our hands on!

It may surprise you, but I went through your junior development program many years ago.

Back then centrals did a pretty average job of looking after their zones, in comparison to other clubs. At some point in the 90's something changed and their efforts were increased and I have no doubt this was part of the success you've experienced.

My point is that development is not just about numbers, as all clubs get equalized, but it's about investment into it.

all clubs get equalised? boy, are you wrong!!

You saying centrals have a smaller recruiting zone?

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[Dutchy]

The key to getting signatures on the petition would be to set up outside entrances to grounds from an hour before the main game with mini Eric's so people are clear before they are approached.

[Hazydog]

Integrity is a concept of consistency of actions, values, methods, measures, principles, expectations, and outcomes.

I reckon thats exactly what we will lose with the introduction of AFL Reserves teams. Couldnt have summed it up any better!

[PhilH]

In terms of raw numbers of Males aged 10-19 it is pretty even.

From that starting point each zone metro & country has its challenges
- Socio-economic conditions
- Cultural backgrounds
- Availability of facilities
- Strength of local football club programs ie auskick
- Strength of schools in playing football
- College commitments
- Options with other sports / activities
- location of zone relative to SANFL club

Its then up to the SANFL through its allocated Development Offices and each club through its development and talent managers on how best to work through those challenges.

[Mr Beefy]

Can someone tell me why the Port model has been shut down so much? Is it the inequality argument only? On face value, the Port model seems to do less damage to the SANFL than Adelaides does.

Mainly, that the concept of having a team playing in the League competition which could not fully focus on a 100% commitment to win the Premiership would water down the integrity of the competition. (ie playing 3 ruckmen, playing kids who were getting a game because they were on the AFL list at the expense of a better player, playing someone for a half because they were resuming from an injury, putting rehab for the following season before playing in the latter stages of the season etc.) Obviously this reasoning also applies to the Crows model as well.

Perhaps a better option would then be to allow Port's SANFL league team to be picked on merit, etc and also allow Port's AFL spuds (and those coming back from injury, 3rd ruckman, etc) to play SANFL reserves?

You mean like they currently do ?

Yes, except all at one club

[maccad]

why can't each of the 8 voting clubs contact their members to see what their opinion is on this matter. I personally would rather see our competition die by it's self than let these awful based teams kill it. As I said in the past the afl side of football in this state wiped their hands of our competition in the 91 and then smeared more mud on it in 97, I am not just talking about the two teams I am talking about the media as well. They don't give a stuff about our level of aussie rules so why should we do anything to help them, they can both get stuffed. go join the vfl.