Swan Districts AFL protest

[kickinit]

What if he has already been drafted Beeny and has no option?

Someone like a Graham Johncock or Darren Pfeiffer.

retirement?

[PhilH]

BeenReal - Seriously??? .. of course the player will be glad to be on an AFL list.

It's the clubs (and their supporters) I was referring to

Developing players only to have them become direct opponents whilst they are surplus to an AFL clubs needs is one of the downfalls of the WAFL hosting model.

It would be like young Johansen being drafted by the Crows in a couple of years
then kicking 5 goals for the Crows Reserves in a game that costs Port Magpies a finals berth.

It's one thing to lose the players interstate, to go onto a bigger and better level of footy
it's another to have them competing against you, playing the same level.

[mickey]

Would someone in WA be able to give a summary of the impact of the AFL "reserves teams" changes in the WAFL this season?
Are crowds up or down (particularly crowds involving the reserves teams)?
Is there more or less interest in the WAFL in general by the public and media?
Has it made Peel and East Perth more or less competitive? Do they appear to be trying to win games as much as the other teams?
Has the initial backlash to the changes died down? Or is there still a lot of resentment to the changes by the other clubs and WAFL supporters (there must be some given the initial story in this thread)

Or is it still to early to tell and we have to wait until all the changes take place for 2014?

I posed your questions to a mate who is a member of Peel, here is his brief reply.

"But you can literally say that Players are not enjoying it, fans of both clubs don't want to be aligned, expect SANFL to force it on clubs that have debts to pay to the governing body and that there is a divide in the clubs between the AFL players and the WAFL players. Crowds have not gone up, if anything they have gone down. Boards and clubs are divided. "

[LPH]

Possible Scenario:

Young Player from Country Zone (let's say Mt Gambier), 15 yrs old.
In Glenelg Zone.
Bays pay tuition fees & boarding fees for student to go the Sacred Heart College (pluck a figure; $15,000 - conservative if for 3 years (Yr 10 to 12)).
Young player goes through the ranks @ Bays (via Hearts 1st XVIII) - alla Kain Cornes.
Gets Drafted by Port Adelaide in AFL, Port Magpies are the Reserves Side.
Has a 3 year contract but never debuts for AFL team, plays 50 games for Port Magpies.
Then gets traded interstate after his 3 year contract expires.

Where's the return on Glenelg's investment & development of the young player?

No matter how you look at it - it stinks!

This is what is going to happen if we allow the WAFL model to occur in our league.

[whufc]

What if he has already been drafted Beeny and has no option?

Someone like a Graham Johncock or Darren Pfeiffer.

retirement?

The simple solution for SANFL clubs is if players they develop from 15 year olds to AFL lists are then going to be playing against them they simply don't develope players to there full ability. Most clubs would survive without the nominal AFL payment they recieve and it would force the SA AFL clubs to recruit interstates who then have a massive go home factor.

The SA based AFL clubs need these SANFL side wanting to develope players as much as possible

[blues2002]

The SA based AFL clubs need these SANFL side wanting to develope players as much as possible

+All AFL clubs. There ain't no SA draft zone in the AFL.
Unless you mean it's better for SA clubs favour locals.

[whufc]

The SA based AFL clubs need these SANFL side wanting to develope players as much as possible

+All AFL clubs. There ain't no SA draft zone in the AFL.
Unless you mean it's better for SA clubs favour locals.

Yeah, i reckon its pretty fair to say that if there is alot of strong talent coming through SA then it gives the SA based clubs their best possible chance for a couple of reasons-

-no go home factor already settled players
-you would think port and crows would have a much better look and be able to make better choices when drafting SANFL based footballers.
-as it stands SA based kids are already established at some level at SANFL clubs rather than interstate players who have to be mini drafted etc etc.

[kickinit]

Possible Scenario:

Young Player from Country Zone (let's say Mt Gambier), 15 yrs old.
In Glenelg Zone.
Bays pay tuition fees & boarding fees for student to go the Sacred Heart College (pluck a figure; $15,000 - conservative if for 3 years (Yr 10 to 12)).
Young player goes through the ranks @ Bays (via Hearts 1st XVIII) - alla Kain Cornes.
Gets Drafted by Port Adelaide in AFL, Port Magpies are the Reserves Side.
Has a 3 year contract but never debuts for AFL team, plays 50 games for Port Magpies.
Then gets traded interstate after his 3 year contract expires.

Where's the return on Glenelg's investment & development of the young player?

No matter how you look at it - it stinks!

This is what is going to happen if we allow the WAFL model to occur in our league.

there was a article about a month back about the changes in the college football. They now have a table and play for points, which has gotten the college's to hand out more scholarships. And from memory there was one of the jnr sanfl coaches saying it was hurting the comp as more kids where concentrating on college football over sanfl.

[heater31]

Possible Scenario:

Young Player from Country Zone (let's say Mt Gambier), 15 yrs old.
In Glenelg Zone.
Bays pay tuition fees & boarding fees for student to go the Sacred Heart College (pluck a figure; $15,000 - conservative if for 3 years (Yr 10 to 12)).
Young player goes through the ranks @ Bays (via Hearts 1st XVIII) - alla Kain Cornes.
Gets Drafted by Port Adelaide in AFL, Port Magpies are the Reserves Side.
Has a 3 year contract but never debuts for AFL team, plays 50 games for Port Magpies.
Then gets traded interstate after his 3 year contract expires.

Where's the return on Glenelg's investment & development of the young player?

No matter how you look at it - it stinks!

This is what is going to happen if we allow the WAFL model to occur in our league.

there was a article about a month back about the changes in the college football. They now have a table and play for points, which has gotten the college's to hand out more scholarships. And from memory there was one of the jnr sanfl coaches saying it was hurting the comp as more kids where concentrating on college football over sanfl.

He used it as a Hypothetical. I agree that there is no way in hell that the Bays would pay to send a kid to SHC for education as the SHC would want to hoard them all for their own self gratification

Far more likely find a to find the kid a host family near the club and have them attend Brighton High.

[kickinit]

Possible Scenario:

Young Player from Country Zone (let's say Mt Gambier), 15 yrs old.
In Glenelg Zone.
Bays pay tuition fees & boarding fees for student to go the Sacred Heart College (pluck a figure; $15,000 - conservative if for 3 years (Yr 10 to 12)).
Young player goes through the ranks @ Bays (via Hearts 1st XVIII) - alla Kain Cornes.
Gets Drafted by Port Adelaide in AFL, Port Magpies are the Reserves Side.
Has a 3 year contract but never debuts for AFL team, plays 50 games for Port Magpies.
Then gets traded interstate after his 3 year contract expires.

Where's the return on Glenelg's investment & development of the young player?

No matter how you look at it - it stinks!

This is what is going to happen if we allow the WAFL model to occur in our league.

there was a article about a month back about the changes in the college football. They now have a table and play for points, which has gotten the college's to hand out more scholarships. And from memory there was one of the jnr sanfl coaches saying it was hurting the comp as more kids where concentrating on college football over sanfl.

He used it as a Hypothetical. I agree that there is no way in hell that the Bays would pay to send a kid to SHC for education as the SHC would want to hoard them all for their own self gratification

Far more likely find a to find the kid a host family near the club and have them attend Brighton High.

knew it was hypothetical. from memory though the article was mainly about kids perferring to play college football over sanfl.

[whufc]

Ummm they don't have a choice the colleges make them play for them over the SANFL clubs

[on the rails]

Good points there LEH however doubt any SANFL Club is paying private college tuition fees. They may contribute to some costs re moving them / families down.

[kickinit]

What if he has already been drafted Beeny and has no option?

Someone like a Graham Johncock or Darren Pfeiffer.

retirement?

The simple solution for SANFL clubs is if players they develop from 15 year olds to AFL lists are then going to be playing against them they simply don't develope players to there full ability. Most clubs would survive without the nominal AFL payment they recieve and it would force the SA AFL clubs to recruit interstates who then have a massive go home factor.

The SA based AFL clubs need these SANFL side wanting to develope players as much as possible

wouldn't do much if the sanfl club didn't develop kids to their full potential. with college footy and state footy recruiters would know if they are going to be good or not. The only player that stands out to me to have left a hole in the club for going home is Tippett, and really that's only because walkers has done his knee. Yeh there have been a few go home but no one that has been a real big loss.

[kickinit]

Ummm they don't have a choice the colleges make them play for them over the SANFL clubs

yeh but not every footballer can afford private college. With more scholarships means more kids taken out of/ away from the sanfl system.

[The Sleeping Giant]

Scott Thompson, Darren Jarman, Matthew Robran, Tony Maguiness. Oh wait.

[whufc]

Ummm they don't have a choice the colleges make them play for them over the SANFL clubs

yeh but not every footballer can afford private college. With more scholarships means more kids taken out of/ away from the sanfl system.

Which gives other kids who would have missed out an opportunity to play SANFL underage.

The colleges can't cater for the 400 kids that play u-18,s a year and most country/amatuer clubs don't have the funds/facilities to develope the u/18 to AFL standard.

How much knowledge do you have of the amount of preparation/development SANFL clubs do for these kids in readiness for AFL/senior football

The AFL needs a combination of colleges and SANFL kids to get the best out of junior footballers

[The Sleeping Giant]

Jack Watts was drafted straight out of the college system wasn't he? Working well for him.

[The Dark Knight]

Jack Watts was drafted straight out of the college system wasn't he? Working well for him.

Yes he sure was TSG, went straight from school boy footy to the AFL.

[kickinit]

Ummm they don't have a choice the colleges make them play for them over the SANFL clubs

yeh but not every footballer can afford private college. With more scholarships means more kids taken out of/ away from the sanfl system.

Which gives other kids who would have missed out an opportunity to play SANFL underage.

The colleges can't cater for the 400 kids that play u-18,s a year and most country/amatuer clubs don't have the funds/facilities to develope the u/18 to AFL standard.

How much knowledge do you have of the amount of preparation/development SANFL clubs do for these kids in readiness for AFL/senior football

The AFL needs a combination of colleges and SANFL kids to get the best out of junior footballers

it takes a lot of developement to take kids to afl level. The point your missing though is the kids more then likely to be drafted into afl will be playing college football and if the college is paying for them to go there not much chance of them playing at sanfl level. Yes that does mean there will be extra kids that will get a chance to play sanfl jnr's but more then likely they won't go on to play sanfl league or ressie's

[LPH]

Yeah, it is a hypothetical but you get the gist, yeah?

This is the problem essentially with the concept of AFL Reserves Teams.
There is no reward for development of players within a Club's Zoned Areas - Port Magpies & whoever (let's say Sturt) don't need to do much at all really, they will get AFL quality players, with AFL quality training & medical assistance - not to mention the facilities.

Now, Victorians would say "Welcome to our World" but they never had to change/move the goal posts.
Their competition just expanded by removing 2 clubs out of Melbourne (South & Fitzroy) & gaining extra Interstate Clubs.

The VFA was a good quality competition in it's own right - they fielded a team in Div 2 of State Carnivals that was always very competitive.
The VFA competition has been ruined by the removal of the VFL/AFL Reserves Competition.
(FFS, they have 2 x Teams that are the Tigers competing in the same competition! What a joke!)

We are in danger of becoming AFLSA - that is what Dimetripoo wants.
OUR Sport of 'Australian Rules Football' has been branded "AFL" - they have been very clever in doing this.
Kids refer to the sport as "AFL" now. The 'Northern States' refer to it too.

If we don't fight to maintain the integrity of our competition - then we are doomed to go the way of the VFA & sadly (it appears) the WAFL.

This is NOT an Anti-Port, or Anti-Crows thing - in fact I would not be overly unhappy if they fielded their Reserves Teams in the SANFL Reserves competition, I would prefer not but that might be a reasonable compromise.

What is MOST concerning is the 'deafening silence' coming from the SANFL - where is their response to the issue?
This suggests the decision has already been made.

In 1990, the SANFL fought 'tooth & nail' to stop PAFC joining the VFL - all in the name of "keeping our competition a viable one with integrity".
Why are they not doing the same now? The cynic in me would say "$$$$$".

Is this issue any different to the Coles & Woolies Duopoly issue?
The 'big boys' forcing the 'little guy' out of business, for greed & just because they can.