Port Magpies

[Wedgie]

I used to go to both Port and Adelaide games in the late 90s as I was a Footy Pk member. Funny as buggery as I'd end up having argument with both sets of supporters at showdowns as they were both as ignorant as each other. Its quite comical abusing Port and Crows supporters at the same time at a Showdown!

Of couse I got the usual "Go back to Victoria" "When was the last time Geelong won a premiership", blah, blah, blah. He who laughs last.........

Used to get my biggest kicks when the Power supporters would leave early and I'd tell them you wouldn't see Crows fans doing that!
Then when I went to Crows games I'd do the same in reverse!

Geez I was a stirrer in my 20s, god knows how I survived that decade!

Although their supporters were morons I must admit I didn't mind the Power in those days as they were like a Crows Mk2 hence why the got good crowds, as time evolved they went back to their Port roots and accordingly crowd (myself included) and support went backwards, silly boys.

[Dutchy]

probably not but I would go to their games if at the Oval and they are more likely to get the next generation supporting them with no reference to Port, doing it all at the same time when they move to the AO would be the go, done correctly they could easily pick up neutrals who go for a look as permanent members/followers

And what are you going to do with the 30000 or so current PAP members? Remove the Port reference and what do they have left? They'll walk away from footy in the state and 90% won't rock up to SANFL games instead. What all their junior members and the kids already on board?

Go the Adelaide Power ... everyone's "second" AFL team. Hey, in 25 years they'll get this "next generation" through so no dramas there. I am sure the AFL will be patient with them.

Why don't you put your idea as a poll on PowerfromPort.com and see how good an idea they think it is

After all the posts you made in support of the NMFC when everyone was saying they should relocate (and how important it was that the club retain it's identity) I am surprised at how casually you dismiss the Power's supporters.

They wont walk away if you do it right, they will stick and all of a sudden you may increase your membership

Relocating 2500 kms is a bit different from 15kms....

[csbowes]

I am first and foremost a south supporter but followed Carlton until the crows come in.
The crows to me represent all SANFL teams are the team for all south australians!!!

OK. Now I feel ill...

[Macca19]

They wont walk away if you do it right, they will stick and all of a sudden you may increase your membership

Depends how it is done, and I dunno about others but I support the Port Adelaide Football Club, not a nickname. Adelaide Power means nothing to me.

[Hondo]

They wont walk away if you do it right, they will stick and all of a sudden you may increase your membership

Depends how it is done, and I dunno about others but I support the Port Adelaide Football Club, not a nickname. Adelaide Power means nothing to me.

I'd say most PAP supporters would be the same.

This crowd thing gets over-complicated by all these club identity theories. The PAP people have no issue with the Port heritage (obviously!) so that's go to be your foundation of the supporter base. Don't mess with it.

As I understand it, they only need another 5000 people on average per home game to make all the difference to their bottom line. 5000 out of 1m people in this state doesn't need major identity shifts to fix. Or, put it this way, you'd be a crazy CEO in your last year in the job if you thought risking the existing 25000 dropping off is worth the "Adelaide Power" punt just to chase the missing 5000 people.

People talk like they need to find 50,000 new supporters tomorrow. They don't.

[Barto]

I am first and foremost a south supporter but followed Carlton until the crows come in.
The crows to me represent all SANFL teams are the team for all south australians!!!

OK. Now I feel ill...

You want nausea? Cop that:

[GWW]

I'm the same, i wouldn't support Adelaide "Power".

[Barto]

Or, put it this way, you'd be a crazy CEO in your last year in the job if you thought risking the existing 25000 dropping off is worth the "Adelaide Power" punt just to chase the missing 5000 people.

Exactly, piss farting around to try and gain a few extra supporters only pisses off the people committed. Check Fitzroys constant tinkering and moving around or North Melbourne's nomadic experiment.

Every time I've seen people move a social event because a few cant make it, always end up with less people. Have something solid and stick with it.

[Punk Rooster]

The thing about the Crows is once they came in, Adelaide media and fans became everything we criticised Vic fans for being. i.e. self centred, arrogant, no one plays football but us. That was probably the worst thing of all and that's definitely what made me move completely away from having them as a second side and only supporting North Melbourne.

Hear, hear!
That's why I stayed with Collingwood.
And while I've had my doubts about it over the years, I only have to hear a rant from KG or Cornesey or someone like that to know I made the right decision.

x 2

[Hondo]

I didn't mind the Power in those days as they were like a Crows Mk2 hence why the got good crowds, as time evolved they went back to their Port roots and accordingly crowd (myself included) and support went backwards, silly boys.

This is an urban legend that doesn't stack up IMO. This common theory assumes that Port started in 1997 as Crows mk2 100%, Port Adelaide 0% and then 90/10 in 1998 to 2009 Crows mk2 0%, Port Adelaide 100%. I don't recall any such steady evolution to being "more" Port especially given the infamous "creed" thing only started in 2009. They were Port Adelaide in 1997 and I hated them. They are Port Adelaide in 2009 and I hate them just as much.

But, OK, lets accept that's what happened and look at the average Port Power home game attendances by year (W-L in brackets). We need to look for a steady decline from 1997 to 2009.

1997: 35,829 (10-11-1)
1998: 31,799 (9-12-1)
1999: 31,629 (12-10)
2000: 26,377 (7-14-1)
2001: 30,775 (16-6)
2002: 30,411 (18-4)
2003: 32,371 (18-4)
2004: 35,182 (17-5)
2005: 32,911 (11-10-1)
2006: 27,257 (8-14)
2007: 29,944 (15-7)
2008: 23,842 (7-15)
2009: 24,349 (9-13)

Yes, compare 1997 to 2009 and there's a big drop. But analyse like a statistician would and look for correlations. 1997 is only matched by their premiership season and can almost be considered an outlier because of the curiosity factor of a new team in their first season that I think drew the extra people.

Even if you don't want to exclude 1997 I think it's clear what the most obvious factor is. Just look at the W-L in each year. Clearly, on field performance is a key driver of their crowds rather than (IMO) some theoretical identity issue. Look at 2005, it's their 3rd biggest crowd average yet their "evolution to be Port Adelaide" would have been in it's 8th season if that theory was true.

2008 and 2009 have been disastrous for crowds just as they have seen 2 of the worst W-L ratios for home games in their short history. You could also argue the "creed" caused 2009's average yet it doesn't explain 2008 and it ignores the poor on field performances in both years.

These are my conclusions and I am happy to have any flaws pointed out by anybody because it's been done in 10 minutes, Stats courtesy of http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/atte ... =A&h=A&s=T

[Hondo]

The thread title "Port Magpies" just doesn't do justice to the range of issues, sports and countries we have discussed

I reckon it could sit in at least 4 different forums so far!

[Punk Rooster]

People talk about the Port Adelaide Football Club as some sort of comodity, as though the AFL version purchased the rights from the SANFL version.

Tell me this,in amatuer league circles do clubs have their heritage questioned when they move from one division to the next?

Do amatuer league clubs not have the ability to claim a Div 1 flag from years ago now that they are in Div 3?

Do amatuer league clubs have to find a new identity / heritage when they change divisions?

I dont think they do, so why, why cant the "Port Adelaide Football Club" which now has a team represent it in the AFL not have the same rights?

when a club moves up a division, they don't leave a shadow club in it's place!

[bayman]

The thread title "Port Magpies" just doesn't do justice to the range of issues, sports and countries we have discussed

I reckon it could sit in at least 4 different forums so far!

if i said ''wanna bet on it'' ? that'd make 5 different forums

[Macca19]

This is an urban legend that doesn't stack up IMO.

Correct.

[Barto]

This is an urban legend that doesn't stack up IMO.

Correct.

The figures still show that their best support was in 1997, even better than the years they finished minor premiers. They finished top in 2002 and still had over 5000 less people at their games. There must be a reason besides win/loss ratios.

[dedja]

There must be a reason besides win/loss ratios.

Live telecasts against the gate, cost of tickets, global financial crisis is a good start ...

[Punk Rooster]

There must be a reason besides win/loss ratios.

Live telecasts against the gate, cost of tickets, global financial crisis is a good start ...

absolute rubbish.

[Barto]

There must be a reason besides win/loss ratios.

Live telecasts against the gate, cost of tickets, global financial crisis is a good start ...

absolute rubbish.

Agree.

The "financial crisis" hasn't been going since 1998. Port Power fans are constantly whinging about the draw and blaming the AFL by saying that games aren't programmed in their preferred time slot. Port people have never come out and said what their preferred time is to get off their arses and actually go to Football Park for a game. For such a large loyal supporter base (as we've been told for decades) they seem to have a victim mentality.

Why would the league be out to get them like I've read from many Port supporters? It'd be like getting a tenant in your investment property and making sure they're out of work and subsequently dont have an income to pay the bills, it wouldn't make sense.

[Psyber]

... As I understand it, they only need another 5000 people on average per home game to make all the difference to their bottom line. 5000 out of 1m people in this state doesn't need major identity shifts to fix. Or, put it this way, you'd be a crazy CEO in your last year in the job if you thought risking the existing 25000 dropping off is worth the "Adelaide Power" punt just to chase the missing 5000 people.

People talk like they need to find 50,000 new supporters tomorrow. They don't.

Good point Hondo.
As with political parties the core supporters stick no matter what you do.
The swinging voters/supporters, as you said in your following post, emerge with on field success.
So, it makes sense to not gamble on losing the core, but to sort out the reasons for on field failure and market a successful product to the potential new fans.
They may become loyal and committed if you keep them around for long enough, by delivering the goods.

[Booney]

Agree.

The "financial crisis" hasn't been going since 1998. Port Power fans are constantly whinging about the draw and blaming the AFL by saying that games aren't programmed in their preferred time slot. Port people have never come out and said what their preferred time is to get off their arses and actually go to Football Park for a game. For such a large loyal supporter base (as we've been told for decades) they seem to have a victim mentality.

Do some homework before sprouting that off. Port members ( like most clubs I would think ) get surveyed regularly and the last two surveys have suggested Saturday night and Sunday games ( 2:40 not 12:30 or twighlight ) games are most preferred.

Sorry if we failed to call you with the results.

The problem lies with the on field efforts. Win games, people want to go. Win games,people want to watch ( = Fox/7/10 want to show you ) then you get the prime time slots.

Look at how many Sunday arvo games Melbourne had last year, 6 IIRC, how are they supposed to draw crowds to a Sunday 4:30 game against the Roos,Freo for one of them? The AFL give the best teams the best ( prime time TV ) slots, and rightly so.Get our on field in order and the AFL will schedule us more premium time slots.