Port Adelaide Reunification Exceeds Expectations!

[Hondo]

Or Jar man out

[on the rails]

Moved this post to the other thread!

[Barto]

I have read this thread with interest since since this story broke as well as "thepowerfromport" forums and "Adelaide Now" comments.

First off, this site (despite what we all think at times) has passionate and in the main well balanced views and opinions on this whole "Port Adelaide" mess. The other two sites I mentioned are full of half truths, emotional rants and bullshit finger pointing and blame at the SANFL and in particular the 8 State League Clubs.

I wish I could post even half of what I know about this mess and the potential impact "it may have" on the SANFL and the State League Comp but I cannot simply because it is both confidential and controversial. Posters like the well balanced Phil H, Dutchy and a couple of others from their close involvement with their clubs probably are privy to some or all I know behind the scenes about this mess SA Football has got itself in - and to be honest not intentionally although some or one party in particular is far more at fault than any other!

My only comment re blame is to say that the PAFC should look in their own backyard and so should "scaremongers" like Rucci who continue to perpetuate the myth that the 8 non Port SANFL Clubs are "bleeding" the AFL Clubs and in particular the PAFC dry of their hard earned funds!. Trust me it is all mostly bullshit!

The dividend that the SANFL clubs receive from the AFL and SANFL $$$ is already dictated to by the AFL in terms of where it goes and I know for fact fact that my club and 1 other (and I'm sure it is the same with the remainder) have to direct that money back into youth and zone development.

80 percent of the dividend returned to the SANFL clubs is not money directly raised or funded by either the Crows or Power, although you could argue AFL distribution money for TV rights coukd be tied to each club and collectively due to them producing the event - e.g. Providing the actual product?

Choose to believe this or not - but anyone close enough to their SANFL Clubs and their Admin / Boards can find out the "real story".

Time for the 8 SANFL clubs to make a stand united and once and for all and call the SANFL Executive and Commission to task or form a breakaway league without AFL influence to the levek it is at present or will be out of our control by the time the AO revamp is complete? If we don't we are in serious danger of seeing the SANFL as we know it "diluted" severely to just a feeder comp most likely branded "AFLSA"!

TIME TO ACT NOW before it is too late!
uate

This is an excellent post and it's how I've understood the dividend is spent, but if you take that to the people who are screaming about the "bleeding dry" and "financial raping" of Port Adelaide, it will fall on deaf ears.

If the SANFL really were taking the AFL clubs money and pissing it against the wall, then the AFL would've done something to stop it a long time ago.

[Hondo]

I agree this is nothing to do with the SANFL dividend or anything the SANFL clubs have done or haven't done since 1997. Whether the SANFL at the top levels has done everything right I am not sure and clearly PAFC management have done a lot wrong.

Royal City and I had a long winded debate that covered a whole lot of issues and yet I believe we agreed on more than we disagreed on. Not that it might seem that way to others. Or even to him. Even though I had issues with his posting style I always felt he had the SANFL's best interests at heart and I can't have an issue with that. If he feels the AFL getting financially involved with the PAFC is armageddon then it's armegeddon. I reckon the SANFL will get out of this one way or another but we'll see.

I'll leave this debate to the other thread and for others closer to the action to continue on.

[The Riddler]

@ Riddler

I'd add, as I tried to say to RC, that in spite of the problems created by the PAFC issues, most of the SANFL have independently improved their business models so they are now mostly recording profits. So there were and are some positives happening.

I have never, and still don't, argued with anyone that Port aren't in serious strife. That's Captain Obvious. The debate in my mind was what would the ultimate outcome of that strife be.

That was my take on our debate anyway. I appreciate others looked at what I was saying to RC in a different way. You can take my views however you want. I don't really want to re-open the debate again! What are we debating anyway? That Port are in strife and it's tough times for footy in this state. I think we agree. I think the AFL have been slow in coming to the party TBH.

Hondo we agree Royal City was a very passionate SANFL supporter. So why would he state the SANFL would die without Port. I believe he stated the complete opposite constantly to you.

He argued the SANFL had got in over their heads and should of cut Port of years ago. Making the AFL come to the party. He said numerously the constant backing of Port was a financial drain on the SANFL league/clubs and it needed to stop. He even pointed you to the sanfls financials constantly.

You denied all of it and said everything was fine.

Your question is any SANFL club clubs directly affected at this stage? As RC pointed out to you 12 months ago YES. Remember it was about the same time you accused a SANFL CEO of overreacting about a dinner and scaring his members.

Do you still think he overreacted or was the CEO simply stating his honest concerns ?

[Hondo]

Riddler, I have answered your questions already. You are trying to make your own point about Port Adelaide and that's fine, just don't do it through trying to prove a point to me. Use the other thread to say what you want?

FWIW, I never said to RC everything was fine even though he kept insisting that's what I was saying. I think you need to re-read those threads. You might also find it was me pointing RC to the SANFL financials, not the other way around.

If only my arguments with RC were as simple as one right and one wrong.

Anyway, how many more times do you want me to talk about him!?

[TimmiesChin]

The dividend that the SANFL clubs receive from the AFL and SANFL $$$ is already dictated to by the AFL in terms of where it goes and I know for fact fact that my club and 1 other (and I'm sure it is the same with the remainder) have to direct that money back into youth and zone development.

If the SANFL really were taking the AFL clubs money and pissing it against the wall, then the AFL would've done something to stop it a long time ago.

Am I understanding correctly that you guys are suggesting the AFL are dictating where and how SANFL clubs spend their money ..... this would be the first I've heard of it.

Wasn't the entire reason the SANFL knocked back a direct AFL funding model 5 or 6 years ago, because they didn't want the AFL interfering ?

[on the rails]

A good part of the income to the SANFL is AFL generated money through TV rights and sponsorship etc as well as profits from games days as a result of their (the AFL) "product / brand" and if you don't think they don't direct the SANFL who direct the SANFL clubs where that money goes then you are in for a shock! Trust me it happens and has for sometime. The SANFL rejected a few years back an AFLSA proposal but it could likely happen the way things are at present with all the rumours, scarmongering and uncertainty.

One thing is certain - if Andy and co at the AFL bail out the PAFC they will want lots in return and I would assume would have a fair say in how SA and the SANFL spends it's dollars generated from the AFL product / brand.

AFLSA doesn't look far away now!

[The Riddler]

Riddler, I have answered your questions already. You are trying to make your own point about Port Adelaide and that's fine, just don't do it through trying to prove a point to me. Use the other thread to say what you want?

FWIW, I never said to RC everything was fine even though he kept insisting that's what I was saying. I think you need to re-read those threads. You might also find it was me pointing RC to the SANFL financials, not the other way around.

If only my arguments with RC were as simple as one right and one wrong.

Anyway, how many more times do you want me to talk about him!?

Alright in my busy schedule I have found time to read through previous posts on the topic....I don't want to argue I'm merely stating RC has been saying this for ages and all of you blokes used to knock him down, Why? Because he didn't agree with your views?

Here you go.....

ROYAL CITY "The fact is the SANFL's only hope now is that this inevitable golden rainbow of revenue that is the AFL. Will finally deliver to the 2 SA based AFL clubs, The SANFL, The SANFL clubs, Junior football in SA so much money, the likes of which we have never seen before.

Sorry to repeat myself . It aint going to happen."


HONDO "Do you think the SANFL and the 9 clubs are financially healthier as a group than they were 20 years ago? I think they might be. That's not all thanks to the AFL either. A financial comparison would be interesting. There's prostituting yourself out as someone put it and then there's making the best financially out of a drastically changed national football landscape. From SA footy's POV it's a pity it wasn't the SANFL who formed the inevitable national competition but that can't be changed now. We can keep getting upset about it or make the best of it as we can.

Do you know how much money flows to the SANFL and junior football from the AFL or AFL related sources? I don't. But before we start making too big a claim we should know this figure.

I feel the SANFL comp is as strong as it has been since the Power came into the AFL and generally the financial statements coming out of the SANFL clubs seem to be positive and improving.

While I respect your opinion I feel that things are not as bad as you think they are."

Obviously Im misreading this RC point and your reply...your claim RC refused to read financials Im sure myself along with everyone on safooty will agree is hilarious!

[Hondo]

Obviously Im misreading this RC point and your reply...your claim RC refused to read financials Im sure myself along with everyone on safooty will agree is hilarious!

Mate, if you felt so strongly about RC's welfare at the time why didn't you actually get onto your keyboard? Now 6 months later you want everyone to apologise to RC. And what are you trying to say in this quote? That I didn't read the SANFL, AFL and PAFC or any financials? I read them all several times.

RC and I spend many posts arguing many things to the point where we were often just arguing with each other for the sake of arguing. He made several claims that were proved factually incorrect by me and others and (pains me to admit) on some things he knew more than I did. When arguing with him it's tough to pin him down on exactly what point he is making or even what we are arguing about. It's tough times, no question from me. I agreed with RC at the time it was tough times. I didn't agree with all of his related opinions on the future of footy in this state but we won't know who was right or wrong for probably 5 years or so.

Is that enough on this you reckon?

[The Riddler]

Obviously Im misreading this RC point and your reply...your claim RC refused to read financials Im sure myself along with everyone on safooty will agree is hilarious!

Mate, if you felt so strongly about RC's welfare at the time why didn't you actually get onto your keyboard? Now 6 months later you want everyone to apologise to RC. And what are you trying to say in this quote? That I didn't read the SANFL, AFL and PAFC or any financials? I read them all several times.

RC and I spend many posts arguing many things to the point where we were often just arguing with each other for the sake of arguing. He made several claims that were proved factually incorrect by me and others and (pains me to admit) on some things he knew more than I did. When arguing with him it's tough to pin him down on exactly what point he is making or even what we are arguing about. It's tough times, no question from me. I agreed with RC at the time it was tough times. I didn't agree with all of his related opinions on the future of footy in this state but we won't know who was right or wrong for probably 5 years or so.

Is that enough on this you reckon?

RC was a big boy and getting his point across rather well I thought, given he aint around anymore to defend himself someone has to.

Nobodies asked you to apologise mate.
You were the one coming onto this tread saying RC was incorrect without any provocation.
I think RC had many valid points about the PAFC and spiral effect it had on the SANFL and I think those points he made have been proven correct in the last 48 hours.

Is this enough on this you ask? Purely up to you and your ego I would say.

[Hondo]

Is this enough on this you ask? Purely up to you and your ego I would say.

Well, it's enough for me. He/we needed you in the debate 6 months ago!

I guess I am having issue with the simplification of RC's various arguments across a range of issues (some of which were clearly wrong, some of which were right) into one simple argument that you say is now proved right. I think the debate that was had went into the issues a lot deeper than that and I didn't disagree with him that PAFC were causing big problems for the SANFL. What the outcome of those problems would be was a lot of what we argued about.

Yes, RC is a sore point for me I should have just left this thread alone. Agreed?

Lets see how it all pans out from here. I think we all agree it's tough times for the SANFL.

[CENTURION]

Tough times we didn't want, can we sue?

[beenreal]

Riddler, I have answered your questions already. You are trying to make your own point about Port Adelaide and that's fine, just don't do it through trying to prove a point to me. Use the other thread to say what you want?

FWIW, I never said to RC everything was fine even though he kept insisting that's what I was saying. I think you need to re-read those threads. You might also find it was me pointing RC to the SANFL financials, not the other way around.

If only my arguments with RC were as simple as one right and one wrong.

Anyway, how many more times do you want me to talk about him!?

Alright in my busy schedule I have found time to read through previous posts on the topic....I don't want to argue I'm merely stating RC has been saying this for ages and all of you blokes used to knock him down, Why? Because he didn't agree with your views?

Here you go.....

ROYAL CITY "The fact is the SANFL's only hope now is that this inevitable golden rainbow of revenue that is the AFL. Will finally deliver to the 2 SA based AFL clubs, The SANFL, The SANFL clubs, Junior football in SA so much money, the likes of which we have never seen before.

Sorry to repeat myself . It aint going to happen."


HONDO "Do you think the SANFL and the 9 clubs are financially healthier as a group than they were 20 years ago? I think they might be. That's not all thanks to the AFL either. A financial comparison would be interesting. There's prostituting yourself out as someone put it and then there's making the best financially out of a drastically changed national football landscape. From SA footy's POV it's a pity it wasn't the SANFL who formed the inevitable national competition but that can't be changed now. We can keep getting upset about it or make the best of it as we can.

Do you know how much money flows to the SANFL and junior football from the AFL or AFL related sources? I don't. But before we start making too big a claim we should know this figure.

I feel the SANFL comp is as strong as it has been since the Power came into the AFL and generally the financial statements coming out of the SANFL clubs seem to be positive and improving.

While I respect your opinion I feel that things are not as bad as you think they are."

Obviously Im misreading this RC point and your reply...your claim RC refused to read financials Im sure myself along with everyone on safooty will agree is hilarious!

Gee someone's got Waaaaaay too much time on his hands.

Any chance RC might actually write for himself? Or perhaps he currently is....

[holden78]

In 1990 Port wanted to go it alone and now 21 years later they should be cut free by the SANFL , then we can watch them be financially proped up by the Gayfl forever .... their crowds are only going to get worse even at Adelaide Oval , unless the ticket prices get massively discounted by Vlad & co.

[Reddeer]

In 1990 Port wanted to go it alone and now 21 years later they should be cut free by the SANFL , then we can watch them be financially proped up by the Gayfl forever .... their crowds are only going to get worse even at Adelaide Oval , unless the ticket prices get massively discounted by Vlad & co.

Ditto

[hereselmo1]

In 1990 Port wanted to go it alone and now 21 years later they should be cut free by the SANFL , then we can watch them be financially proped up by the Gayfl forever .... their crowds are only going to get worse even at Adelaide Oval , unless the ticket prices get massively discounted by Vlad & co.

Please do!

[Barto]

In 1990 Port wanted to go it alone and now 21 years later they should be cut free by the SANFL , then we can watch them be financially proped up by the Gayfl forever .... their crowds are only going to get worse even at Adelaide Oval , unless the ticket prices get massively discounted by Vlad & co.

Please do!

Good luck with it, but as we've seen your club doesn't really have the support to be viable. 20k At AOI, 20k at Bellerive or 20k At Manuka.. doesn't really matter to the AFL, as long as they get to spend less money and have 18 teams to keep their TV deal alive.

[beenreal]

In 1990 Port wanted to go it alone and now 21 years later they should be cut free by the SANFL , then we can watch them be financially proped up by the Gayfl forever .... their crowds are only going to get worse even at Adelaide Oval , unless the ticket prices get massively discounted by Vlad & co.

Please do!

Good luck with it, but as we've seen your club doesn't really have the support to be viable. 20k At AOI, 20k at Bellerive or 20k At Manuka.. doesn't really matter to the AFL, as long as they get to spend less money and have 18 teams to keep their TV deal alive.

In that case, neither do Melbourne, Bulldogs, North Melbourne... but they find a way.

There were no tarps blocking off sections of Docklands to hide the Pissant crowd during the Port Vs North game, they simply closed off the ENTIRE top level.

[Dutchy]

There were no tarps blocking off sections of Docklands to hide the Pissant crowd during the Port Vs North game, they simply closed off the ENTIRE top level.

And the smart thing to do, dont need to cater or clean the whole top section which equals a better stadium deal. ive been saying for years Port should not open the Northern stand unless there is rain forecast. Why cover the seats in the outer when it saves no $$ ?

More dumb decisions by the Power management.

Ive heard Footy in Tassie are looking at Ports stuggle very very closely, what happens if this next rescue package aint successful?